So many bands reform and perform perfunctory retreads of their glory years, or just keep on slugging away without knowing when to quit. Pop music – it’s a young person’s game, eh? When your nearest and dearest no longer do what they used to do so well, where do you turn for freshly-sourced spring waters of zestful musical exuberance?
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So, you liked Dylan, XTC; Jam, Sisters, New Order*. Who do you like now?
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‘*Add super-annuated/deceased genius of choice
When your heroes run out of gas, where do you turn ?
by 48 Comments
Your heroes will always run out of gas eventually, unless they give up or die.
You move on. Something will pique your interest eventually, unless you give up too, but that’s not gonna happen, right?, or you wouldn’t be here.
I don’t really understand this scenario at all. There have been many posts here in the past few month suggesting the end of some indefinable era but I don’t see it at all. Music is continually mutating and throwing up new artists to enjoy alongside the old favourites. These days there’s really no excuse for not finding it either. Whether it’s via a cover mount on Uncut or the more traditional route of listening to the radio (6 Music exposes you to a wealth of new talent) or using this new fangled Internet thing with it’s huge variety of “if you like this you may like this” options. You could listen to new music all day long without ever having to buy any and if you don’t stumble across something you like and want to follow up then there’s probably little point in pursuing it any further.
Many local libraries (like mine) allow us to download both Q and Mojo for free, I also get five free MP3 downloads a week from them (courtesy of Freegal) . That’s on top of all the free albums (many of them record label samplers) available from NoiseTrade and then there’s the online magazines such as Pitchfork and Paste not forgetting the huge (and ever growing) resources of NPR (specifically it’s ‘First Listen’ pages).
I don’t think you’re answering the question that salwarpe’s asking?
I was answering question 1. Below, you have answered question 2. Neither of us stand to get marks higher than 50% however and accurate and complete our answers are! (Although I think you will definitely drop a mark for putting a question mark at the end of a sentence that doesn’t seem to be a question!)
Maybe HP spent time in Australia or watched Neighbours in the 80s.
No, I’m upspeaking? I do it here sometimes to give myself a kind of contemporary vibe?
I think the inevitable decline of a musical era (and arguably an inevitable decline in the quality of music) is contained in what you’ve written, JW:
‘You could listen to new music all day long without ever having to buy any…’
‘Many local libraries (like mine) allow us to download both Q and Mojo for free, I also get five free MP3 downloads a week from them (courtesy of Freegal) . That’s on top of all the free albums (many of them record label samplers) available from NoiseTrade…’
When an industry – music and the media around it in this case – is based on things being given away for free, sooner or later that content is going to dry up or become increasingly mediocre. Because content takes time, effort and money.
Imagine if the financial model of the baked bean industry suddenly collapsed, yet there still seemed to be a market of consumers keen to eat the stuff. Would Heinz go on manufacturing its high quality tins of beans to give away to people? No. Would mediocre quality beans from lesser manufacturers appear in the medium term, hoping to find a business model that worked, given there was still demand? Probably. But after a few years, if the consumers were still not paying for the product, why would anybody keep making it?
The difference with music is that lots of people get pleasure out of creating it (I’m one such), but with the late 20th Century model collapsing, it follows that within a few years we’ll be left with TV talent shows (where it’s about TV entertainment, not sustainable music careers) and well-intentioned amateurs.
Ultimately, content creators need an incentive, and with the old-school music biz hierarchy greatly diminished and, as far as I can see, irreversibly imploding (though it may still take years, bouyed up by a handful of cash-cow artists like Adele), the lack of any pot of gold at the end of the rainbow will ultimately mean far fewer people dedicating themselves to music.
Make good use of all the free stuff while its there – it’s being given away by people thrashing about hoping desperately to sell something to you.
Based on this logic (more money = better tunes), music must have peaked in the 80s and 90s, no?
You could certainly argue that! Personally, I’d argue that the music *business* peaked in the 80s and 90s!
But there have always been samplers and, in my experience, that has normally led to me actually buying music. I’ve used the Uncut CD like that for many years.
What I was getting at was that, whereas in the old days, discovering new music was more of a financial risk, we can take punt on something that may end up with us buying CDs/downloads and concert tickets.
The stuff from the library is free to me but someone is getting paid, maybe not as much as they would be if I bought the magazine in a shop but I pay for my Uncut sub and wouldn’t otherwise read Q or Mojo so someone gets money there who wouldn’t otherwise.
You’re certainly right about that JW – the access to music, new and old, is almost total these days. And yes, no doubt some of that access will lead to purchasing. So from a voracious consumer’s point of view it’s probably a bit of a golden era. I’m a little nostalgic, just as a consumer, for the time when you had to actually search out music – physically find second hand copies of things by a ‘new’ old artist you’d discovered, not even knowing how many albums there were, what they were called, cos there was just no source of easy info.
(But that’s all separate from the music business model issue – the consumer perspective vs the long-term business perspective.)
I remember when the first Billy Bragg EP/mini album came out. I couldn’t believe that there was nothing else available and spent ages confirming that the 6 tracks I had was the lot! It’s easy to remember individual instances but it’s hard to remember that it was basically like that for anything that hadn’t been released in the past 18 months. It did make trips to that London and the US much more fun though as you could get things there that simply weren’t available (or even known about) in my provincial town.
Indeed! For me, a second hand shop/stall within Belfast’s Smithfield market, run by a couple of strange old biddies, was the regular place to sift for gold in the mid 80s. In amongst the seemingly endless supply of 70s Status Quo albums you could occasionally find a Bert Jansch LP or an Island records sampler and suchlike – fantastic stuff.
I’ve listened to The Church since I bought their first 45 on import, before the first album came out. They’ve continued to engage me (and I suppose be “heroes”) for thirty six years, or whatever it is. Over such a long period they’ve had their ups and downs, but they’ve never become caricatures of themselves or dried up, or even taken a long holiday. Add the side projects and solo albums (Kilbey’s, anyway) and you have an endlessly deep well of music. And their last album is very probably amongst their very best, recorded after Willson-Piper’s epic flounce. So the hits will keep on coming.
“Endlessly deep well”? I suspect there is some limit to their catalogue.
I haven’t found it yet, and I’ve been trying really hard.
We’re going on a trip for two weeks so I’ve downloaded Under The Milky Way to see what you and Chiz find so wonderful.
What, the song?
It’s a best of, according to Spotify
Oh, okay. Probably as good a way as any, but getting into a band with such a massive back catalogue is always tricky. The Blurred Crusade comes near the top of many fans’ lists, so that’s a good bet if you like your best-of.
@davebigpicture
Be really interested to hear what you make of The Church. Like a few others here I’ve been a fan for a while and think they are at times monumental.
And yet when I play them to like minded mates, they are pretty much always non-plussed. Weird.
As HP Chiz says “Blurred Crusade” is pretty much up there as the best but also try their “hit” album Starfish and the , er, sprawling epic that is “Priest = Aura. Oh and Seance if you can get over the clunky production.
Just to disagree with myself, I’d go for Priest=Aura as a starting point. Lush, sparkling and deeply narcotic.
@Freddy_Steddy just finished listening to this. It’s ok, probably benefit from a few more plays but why do I get the feeling it sounds a lot like another band? Can’t place who. Maybe it’s just of its time.
@FreddySteady even
Oh I give up
Don’t give up! I wouldn’t say they’re an acquired taste and I wouldn’t say they sound like another band….to me they sound like no-one else.
I’d have recommended Heyday as the starting point for The Church. I don’t think they sound remotely like anyone else either.
I’m with you on The Church. Loved them since 82. Steve is so prolific it’s hard to keep up. Did you get that Pharmakoi – Distance etc album? Mighty fine…
Ooh yes.
Ah, but how many times did you listen to Bastard Universe?
Well yes …once only I should think . Just got the Shreik soundtrack and Back with two Beasts…not sure why to be honest but they’re not “proper” albums are they?
I watched the Stones newsclip from Cuba and I came to the blog to see if anyone had commented. I know it’s been discusssed here before but I saw your thread salwarpe and wondered whether you had heard Keiths guitar and sparked this thread?
http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-latin-america-35901988
Savages, Wave Pictures, Everything Everything, Slaves. There’s lots of good stuff out there. Like John says, 6 Music plays all sorts of music, new and old.
I find this sort of question infinitely more baffling than MikeH’s new post filed in shortly after (as opposed to his comment in this one, which, I guess, prompted his post) There is soooo much new music out there, whether brand new or just new to me. I find it hard to keep up with it, even if some/much doesn’t appeal to my ears. Or yet to my ears, as I have a history of discovering whole genres as they die down. this site points me in more directions than the music press, whether virtual or printed. And even if your old reliables now let you down,there is always their back catalogue. You are allowed to listen to old too, you know, whether Bach, Beach Boys or Bonobo. But then along comes an e-mail from, say Proper Records and I’m off into new again.
I quite agree.
David Hepworth on his blog last year commented how if you’ve never heard something before, then it’s “New”, regardless of when it was released.
This place serves really well as a knowledgable friend saying ” have a listen to this!” and it’s just as likely to be 30 years old as 30 days old.
There are two distinct differences between “New” and “New to You”.
New means the greater possibility of catching them live and hopefully in a sweaty small venue. Also you can follow them as they go along without the chance of getting overwhelmed.
New to You means less chance of seeing them live but there’s an instant catalogue to investigate. The downside of that, of course is that you have the “where do I start” questions (that everyone seems to have a different answer to) and the sheer breadth of a back catalogue can sometimes be overwhelming and you need to try and build in some braking system into your investigation.
The National.
Agree with all the above, plus look at the listings of smaller local venues and take a chance on someone who looks interesting and is playing for a tenner or so. I’m lucky to have a few friendly venues within reasonable reach that have a good range of new (to me ) faces -in amongst the seemingly interminable tribute acts and touring waxworks(someone else’s heroes I suppose). Try and catch the support act. Pick up a couple of cd’s from the merch table. If it’s a “club night” that means they don’t finish too late so even better. Invariably after I buy a ticket I discover they’ve been going for a while, have a back catalogue, and get interested enough to lead me down some related path…pretty soon the cd’s are hitting the door mat.
case in point – Beverly (Louisiana in May)
http://www.totallyfuzzy.net/ourtube/beverly/honey-do-video_4696279fa.html
I tend to go where my nose takes me, binge on it until I get sick and then move on.
Repeat cycle.
What about music, Poppy?
Thanks for all the responses, guys. I must confess, it’s the start of the half term break and I posted in a moment of ‘exuberance’ and then completely forgot about it. (In answer to your question, Lunaman, no.)
Reading through your answers to my rambling thoughts, there are many good points. I suppose, what I was really asking was, which artists still cut it for you, and if not, who fulfills that role now? Particularly the ones you can still go and see live, as anton and Johnw mention. So, thanks for the specific responses, H.P., gethenet, badartdog, anton.
There is an overwhelming range of music, old and new, out there. Where do you get the targeted, ‘so you like(d) them, have you tried Van Morrison’ kind of guide? Which ones do you use, Johnw?
Tbh, I should probably just read the Blogger take over threads, to find the answer to these questions. Over the last couple of years, I’ve come to find several musical soulmates here, as well as, being honest again, those whose taste vary from mine enough to warn me off…
I think, like Poppy, I like bingeing till I’m sick. I’m discovering the back catalogue of Gallon Drunk, and it’s great. I’m also slowly inculcating myself into the early Little Feat – better than I expected, and worth hearing over and over again, till I get it. The grimey rock’n’roll I posted about before.
The main two places I go to for recommendations based on my past record are Amazon and EMusic. The Amazon algorithm seems to be quite good although you need to put in a bit of effort telling them whether they should base on particular albums or not. I’ve bought at least two albums based on that that I was only otherwise peripherally aware of. The EMusic system is a lot more crude as there’s no way of telling the system that you downloaded something but thought it was awful. It does have a (fairly) useful list of “Similar Artists” on each artist page which I’ve used quite a bit in the past.
So far this year, my main Emusic “discovery” has been the debut “The I Don’t Cares” album which came up in my Emusic Recommendations list which I would like to pass on.
Far more dangerous for me is Discogs where you can get a proper historical sequence plus links to individual brand members etc…a passing interest in the aforementioned Beverly and suddenly I’m ordering cd’s by Frankie Rose & the Outs, Dum Dum Girls and Pains of Being Pure at Heart – I bet they all have a thriving scene and many followers (probably some here) but completely new to me. Some may be in one ear etc but in amongst them may be “the one”.
Another case in point – by the time this cd hit the doormat I forget where I heard about it;
(skip the intro)
1:45
There are huge plusses and minuses in the current state of the Music industry. For me one of the major plusses is the way that artists now engage with their fans – lost count of the number of artists I have seen and subsequently spoken with whilst purchasing their latest release from the merchandise stand. It might be a pain the ass for them, but then again it might not. When I saw Lissie at SXSW last week (at Waterloo Records) she did a record signing afterwards for a line of people maybe close to 100 long. She had a smile and a kind word for everyone and quite frequently a photo shot. I am sure many of those fans will be now committed to her future releases.
The down side is the dizzying amount of artists out there which must surely mean that any chance to further your musical career must be that much harder than it was before. Saw a husband and wife band The Grahams also in Austin – they were hugely talented and obviously a great talent. Their chance of making big money in the industry? Probably nil.
Working in an industry where they struggle to recruit, so I’m well paid for my skill, it’s easy to be glib, but I guess people have got to realise that sometimes, what is essentially a hobby, can’t be monetised into a living so needs to remain a hobby. The unfair bit is that the skills required to do a job like mine (writing software) allow payment and progress to be as close as sensible to a meritocracy, making music simply isn’t and even for us at punter level, it’s a hard thing to get used to.
Being realistic, it’s chiefly because the music “industry” became such a behemoth in the ’70s and ’80s from it’s semi-amateur beginnings in the ’40s, ’50s and ’60s, that there are such a plethora of musical artists trying to do it for a living.
There have always been talented musicians, but most of them would never have even considered trying to make a living at it 50-60 years ago. The fact that so many more now persist to scrape a living from playing music is worthy of our admiration. And our financial support where merited.