I’ve just left a gig by a signed band (who shall remain nameless… for now…). There were 3 musicians on stage, but it was painfully clear that the lead singer / guitarist was carrying the other two. Is there a term for such a person? If there isn’t there should be, & I’m confident the Afterword is capable of inventing it.
Also, has a truly successful band ever been huge off the back of just one talented member? Examples please…
Bizkit!
Whut? Which of Durst and Borland are you besmirching here?
What would LimBiz be without the pairing of that once in a generation guitar sound and those razor sharp rhymes? Alien Ant Farm: that’s what.
And let’s not forget the pulsing rhythms of cousins-in-rock John Otto and Sam Rivers. Not to mention the iconic vinyl scratching of DJ Lethal.
The Jam?
Foxton was/is a phenomenal bassist. He carries much of the melodic lines in Jam songs as Weller just couldn’t carry off lead/rhythm in the same way Wilko could.
Buckler though. Pedestrian. Looking forward to his book.
Wham!
Yes, Ridgeley was by far the finest tan in that band.
The Beatles
Creedence Clearwater Revival and The Jam are two obvious examples. Led to their acrimonious breakups in each case.
CCR had a very talented rhythm section, listen to the difference between CCR and the JF solo records.
The Police
Stewart Copeland didn’t write many songs in The Police (but a couple of those were really good, “Darkness” and “Peanuts” comes to mind), but his album “The Rhythmatist” was fantastic and he’s written a lot of really good film music.
Hear hear. Darkness and the Rhythmatist… top. I love Does Everyone Stare as well.
Yes, Everyone Stares is aces.
He also wrote and performed the music for the children’s console game ‘Spyro the Dragon’ which is pretty damn good.
I’m not being facetious. My wife was playing it (I know…) and she was trying to win one of the series of timed tasks. The rhythm track that backed it caught my ear. On the back of the box; ‘Music by Stewart Copeland’
I wasn’t expecting that.
Don’t forget Klark Kent!! On green vinyl!
AAAAAAAWAY from home!
Andy Summers was no slouch in his department either. A great guitar player with a very distinctive sound and style which few have replicated in mainstream music.
I’d rather listen to a Wham or Jam Best Of than a George Michael or Paul Weller Greatest Hits…
As is your right, howeverhow much did Andrew, Bruce or Rick add to the sum total of those records?
I’ve no axe to grind, perhaps George and Paul simply had more staying power than the others… or on the basis of what happened next maybe they had more input…
FWIW I have precious little Wham, Jam, GM or PW in the digital library so can only comment from the sidelines.
The Jam were a phenomenal live band. I saw them twice. Just an amazing energy. Foxton and Buckler essential to this. And though they wrote little, or nothing, listen to the drumming on Funeral Pyre or the bassline on (for example) Down In the Tubestation. I would offer a contrary rule, and that in a trio (The Police as well) you can’t carry any passengers.
Agree with @moseleymoles. And I would even offer the perhaps controversial opinion that Weller has very rarely done anything as good as his work with The Jam; which is not solely down to the absence of Foxton and Buckler, but I suspect is not entirely unconnected.
I don’t think he ever got close to his Jam work as a solo artist. Wildwood was good but Stanley Rd was never the classic album some make it out to be. Very patchy.
I’ve eulogised a little bit about Foxton above. Buckler though, I can see why Weller wanted shot.
Wake Up The Nation is pretty, pretty close to his very best Jam songs. Some great stuff with the Style Council too. Different sounds, without the vim and vigour of The Jam but “Our Favourite Shop” is a terrific record. Easily the equal of All Mod Cons and Sound Affects.
His first solo album too – with Marco Nelson on bass and Steve Cradock on the guitar was a very good live watch. Again, Steve White drumming – pedestrian….
OOAA of course.
Also Police Singles Collection over Sting Best Of…
I would say about 95% of bands who are successful are reliant on the skills of one man, almost always the songwriter/singer… where the meat on the bones comes in is the talent of the supporting cast. The Who would have been nothing without Townsend, but by golly, the supporting cast were good.
Others?
Early Fairport.. RT with a sound supporting cast.
Early King Crimson… Fripp, with McDonald, Lake and Giles.
I would humbly disagree, Geach – early Fairport (okay, 1970-74) was, to my mind, reliant more on Dave Swarbrick than Thompo. Dave either co-wrote (with Thompo) or solely wrote practically all their new music in this period, including the whole of the Babbacombe Lee concept album and all those quirky songs on Rosie. He was the ‘front man’ on stage, he took on the mantle of lead singer having previously been the recently-joined fiddle player (for a very few months before Sandy Denny and band leader Ashley Hutchings left). The fellow was crucial to FC carrying on, not least in that blurry period when everyone else except him and Dave Pegg left and various otherwise unheard of people joined for a few weeks each to keep some kind of show on the road.
No, Swarbrick is the ‘one’ in early 70s FC. A shy, awkward lead guitar player who kept his head down – no matter how good his playing – would not have been enough to keep the FC ship afloat. Thompo became an entertainer/front person later on, and prolific solo writer, but he wasn’t any of those things in the early 70s.
Is it possible that geacher was referring to pre-Swarbrick Fairport since he missed the first two albums completely and only plays on a few tracks on Unhalfbricking? That said, his comment still seems a bit unfair to Sandy Denny and possibly Ashley Hutchings.
But can anyone claim to be the talented one in today’s Fairport Convention?
Yes: Chris Leslie. It’s relative, of course.
yes, I did mean the “What we Did On Our Holidays” version. I don’t think I was being unfair to Denny or Hutchings, but RT was the talent. I remember seeing an interview with Joe Boyd that he says that was not THAT impressed the first time he saw the Fairports, and signed them on because RT was there.
But when Joe Boyd first saw Fairport Judy Dyble was on vocals. Dismiss Ashley Hutchings if you like but are you seriously saying that Richard Thompson was the only talented member of the band after Sandy Denny joined? I’m a massive fan of RT but I’m not with you there.
Dear god, is it ever! Saw ’em a couple of years back doing the whole of Babacombe Lee followed by some more recent stuff, and to say the difference was marked… Leslie strikes me as a very nice man, but the songwriting these days is twee and uninspired.
I saw them last year when Peggy’s son deputised because his old man had injured his hand. The lack of charisma on stage was marked.
Hmmm, feel an urge to respond for the codgers, even if the material does veer towards easy listening these days. I think it is bollox to think about any one talent obviating any one else having any to spare. The post Dyble line-up, were a glory box of complementary skills between WWDOOH and L&L, with and without Swarbrick. Just listen to the original Fairport version of Who Knows Where the Time Goes. Now Simon Nicol may be the only relic of that day, but is no dab hand on vocals and mainly acoustic guitar. Dave Pegg can still astonish on bass. Chris Leslie can sing like a choirboy and play anything. Ric? Lovely tone on fiddle and Gerry Conway is still alive. Yes, they coast on a wave of fond memories, but on a wave quite high. The new LP isn’t bad and, on their last tour, were brave enough to play only 4 songs from last century (all from L&L), the bulk of the 2 sets coming from the last couple of records. Can’t see many of that era playing so little old and taking the audience with them.
That is quite an understatement, Colin.
Meaning it’s an understatement that, with Chris Leslie, it’s relative.
Putting Richard Thompson and Chris Leslie in the same bracket is quite a stretch.
And what happens when Richard Thompson turns up to play with the band at Cropredy? Are there then two talents in the band?
Has a band ever been successful without a decent front-person?
Apart from the telephonics, obviously.
bloody hell – Stereophonics not telephonics, jeez.
Has a band ever been successful without a decent front-person?
Look no further than one of the greatest bands of all time, the mighty Can.
Vocalists Malcolm Mooney and Damo Suzuki weren’t really ‘frontmen’ as such. sometimes, their contributions seem almost incidental.The band’s innovativeness, charm and enduring brilliance stemmed from the enigmatic four-headed musical powerhouse that was Czukay-Schmidt-Karoli-Liebezeit.
How about Radiohead? That chappee who *sings*, whatsisname, him, you know the one… well.. he’s no frontman, is he? And that guitarist fella, the guy who has his head bowed all the time, he isn’t either.
I’ll admit to relative ignorance of Fairport & King Crimson… which leads to another (longer held) pet theory – take a successful songwriting partnership, any partnership – which individual members have been as good on their own afterwards?
Paul Simon – arguably even better solo
Agreed.
Songwriting partnership.? Simon and Garfunkel? Oh dear.
Perhaps not equal overall, but I reckon Morrissey’s best solo stuff is better than the Smith’s weaker songs.
Taste?
Successful band without a front man ? Grateful Dead
The “Man in the Street” will give you Jerry Garcia 99 times out of a 100
Bruce Foxton was an integral part of The Jam, excellent bass player, occasional songwriter and lead singer, and also does co-vocals on many of their songs. Weller was clearly the main talent, but they were a band and each member contributed
Beatles?
Knopfler and Dire Straits. Decent musicians but his songs, his arrangements, his production (often) and his guitar licks.
Jeff Lynne and ELO. I seem to recall a review of ELO Part 2 (the non Jeff Lynne incarnation) as like ‘tea without the tea bag’.
Surely there’s already a word… Friend!
How about Smashing Pumpkins and Billy Corgan? All the original others were talented musicians but the group could only ever contain one ego like that. Not been any good since the others were replaced though.
Have you listened to the Billy Corgan solo album? a Bee Gees cover does not suggest a man finally free to express his creativity in the way it always should have been… he is a man who is tortured by the fact that it ‘worked’ with the Pumpkins and without it, well…
I dunno. Have a look at the making of Siamese Dream, their best record.
Corgan has undoubtedly lost whatever he once had, but that’s a classic album on which he wrote all the songs and played most of the instruments. James Iha and D’arcy were barely in the studio at all, if legend is to be believed.
Jimmy Chamberlain is a great drummer, but if the Pumpkins don’t qualify for the OP then I don’t know who does.
The Nice?
No wonder he sought L&P
Coldplay ?
Many moons ago, the question was ‘who’s the best doubles pairing in tennis?’ The answer was John McEnroe and anybody else.
Similarly, ‘Who’s the best blues trio?’ The answer being Stevie Ray Vaughan and any other two. No disrespect to Chris and Tommy but SRV was the man.
And the talented member of Coldplay would be? I would suggest that it’s their manager!
The Police are better than Sting solo. The Jam (and for that matter he Style Council) are better than Weller solo. It is known. The Police were three superb musicians, not a talented one and two makeweights. Stuart Copeland is one of my favourite drummers. His playing on Synchronicity 2 and Message In A Bottle, to name but two, is fucking AWESOME, and makes the songs 65% better.
I’m surprised nobody’s mentioned Oasis yet. I was never much of a fan, but *all* their good moments are down to Noel, and I would contend that without him they would have been utter no-hopers.
Oasis without Liam? I’m not having that.
That’s a very precise percentage there, Rosbif.
Have you got some kind of spreadsheet that works it all out?
inclined to agree
But …
Whilst Noel did all the songwriting work, it was Liams voice and attitude that carried it – certainly in the early days, perhaps not when Noel started to write more “introspective” songs (usually based around a modifcation of the Wonderwall riff). The cracks started to show when Liam decided he could write songs too (“Little James” ???).
Liams voice on the first two albums (and Champagne Supernova in particular) is the sound of the band, but he couldn’t have done without Noel.
The other 3 though?
Little & Large.
Syd was a dead weight round Eddie’s neck.
Good job it wasn’t the other way round…
Angel Summoner and The BMX Bandit…
Lets throw one in the 80’s mix. Adam and the Ants? A stunning leader with a middling guitarist who looked like his dad and 2 fairly ordinary drummers…….
I think of Marco Pirroni as a more musically talented Andrew Ridgeley. He was the man who gave Adam the confidence and verve to get things over the line. As it were.
That’s what I was thinking about Wham! Didn’t Simon Napier-Bell say that George Michael reckoned he needed Andrew Ridgeley in the early days to gain confidence? A very amicable split too, it seems – just enough co-writing credits to keep Ridgeley comfortable.
Hey! You’re forgetting the mighty Tibbster!
Of course, the definitive answer is Sleeper.
Of course, that definitive answer shouldn’t have been placed here.
The Hold Steady and The Tragically Hip both have a generic rock sound but it is the quirky singers/lyricists Craig Finn and Gordon Downie who make them both special.
Jack White
Megs Job Description in the White Stripes said “Hit things”
(although if Meg was a superb drummer then The White Stripes wouldn’t have been The White Stripes)
Meg was my favourite. Can’t stick that geezer with the silly voice and the wig.
The energy between those two on stage was extraordinary. Like Moe Tucker or Bobby Gillespie she might not have had “skills” but for that music she was darn perfect
Wholly agree – I was just rolling out the “Meg was a crap drummer” cliche (again!)
Frankie Goes To Hollywood
Talented ones were: Trevor Horn & Paul Morley
Bullshit, Holly’s voice is what shines down the years not the sixth form arty pseudo pseud shite that Morley spat up. And those basslines, no Norman Watt Roy, you are brilliant but not a note you played is on those records, back in yer box, la
Horn & Anne Dudley, naturally
There is only one person who is on as many Frankie records as Trevor and Holly.
CHRIS BARRIE!
..and pertinent to an adjacent thread: who expected Shaun Ryder to resurface – sans the Mondays musicians and plus the ersatz Flavor Flav with the stonkingmost party record of 1995? (Granted, follow ups weren’t up to snuff..)
Kermit! He was in the Ruthless Rap Assassins. They were ace! Not as good as Black Grape, obvs. Who was?
THAT’S the album of 1995 – not those lozzicking eyebrowed twats or that bloke from Bristol burbling in his bath.
Have you listened to it recently Moose?
Specifically: the second half?
Yes. Recently enough to have been reminded of the Troggs tape quote about fairy dust.
Interesting. The last two songs are my second and third favourite on the album.
“…..with the great smell of Brut!”
@DFB Anne Dudley is only on about half of the FGTH stuff. She most certainly IS a genius but in this case Andy Richards probably is the secret ingredient.
Simple Minds are an interesting case here. Plainly Jim Kerr reckons he’s the talented one, but they went shit when bass player Derek Forbes left (just after Don’t You Forget About Me). Some of his work in the early albums (In Trance As Mission, I Travel etc) is just brilliant.
The rot set in when the great Brian McGee left. Mel Gaynor was alright but… just another rock drummer if we’re honest.
The Pub Bore says: “Glen Matlock was the only member of The Sex Pistols who could play”.
Possibly true, but without Cook, Jones and Lydon (who were none too shabby at what they did) where would he be?
And then when he left, it was the other three carrying the one in the band who really couldn’t play
Lydon’s lyrics and voice are the what made the ‘stols extraordinary. And those extraordinary Lon-Chaney-In-A-Wind-Tunnel stage antics.
Yep. As a flip to the question above about bands being ace while having no decent frontman, I would say you could stand Rotten-era Lydon in front of any pisstrough of Sleeperblokes and you would still have an act worthy of attention..
The Spencer Davis Group. Rumour has it that Winwood the Wunderkind used to nip down to the studio when everyone else was in bed and re-record everybody else’s parts on all instruments.
The Partridge Family. Would have been nowt without David Cassidy.
Are you dissing the musical giant that was Danny Bonaduce?
One Direction. Plainly Zayne is the talented one. Like Charlie from Busted or Jon from S Club 7.