Hi all.
Going through a bit of a rough patch, but nothing life-threatening or that most people haven’t been through: long-term marriage problem, perhaps amicable separation on the cards but the kids are fine; an old girlfriend returned to re-enact some anxious/avoidant friendship dynamics; ensuing lack of focus at work and having to leave the classroom in tears. So currently living out of home (but among friends and safe and housed). It’s not a crisis – I’m trying to see it all as a gift or lesson, and part of Lifes Rich Pageant – but much of my reading keeps coming back to the same thing: self esteem. Doing some meditation – check. Good friends to chat to – check. Breathing exercises – check, (but still doesn’t feel natural). Being in nature – boring, but I’m trying to look at the trees.
So my question to the learned folk here: any tips for putting some lead back in the pencil and feeling generally more Ok with yourself? Any strategies that help you ‘speak to yourself as a friend’? Anything to counter that innate sense that you’re just a bit shit?
Sorry if it’s a bit of an amorphous question – just looking for new perspectives and do-able strategies
(Mine are shit! hahaha)
Exercise of any sort improves morale and health creating a virtuous circle.
I am told resistance exercise- weights etc particularly beneficial for blokes in improving mental health.
Seconded. A few years ago when I was gearing up gloomily for a course of radiotherapy the specialist sent me off to the gym for several weeks of weights and rowing machines and suchlike, to top up bone density etc. It was a very carefully thought-out programme tied to age, fitness or lack of and so on, and supervised by a trainer. I absolutely loved it. I was competing against myself, doing x somethings in x minutes, trying to get x1 up or x2 down. I felt really good, both physically and mentally.
Of course once it was over I never went back, pertly because I was so exhausted after the radiotherapy that it seemed impossible, and partly because that’s the kind of fuckup I am. But the point is that I felt really good about myself and ready for anything. I can’t imagine that something similar won’t perk you up a bit.
As for self-esteem in general, all I can say is don’t beat yourself up, and be nice to yourself. Whatever the problem is it won’t be entirely your fault. On that note…I’m off. If Mrs thep caught me being a lifestyle guru I’d never hear the end of it.
Thirded – this was the first thing that came to mind for me. There’s so much that you can’t control in life so try to take control of the things you can positively influence. When I am exercising regularly it leaves me so much more energized and able to deal with everything else more effectively. It also gives me something to feel good about myself. Get a smart watch if you haven’t one already – it really helps to see what you are getting done. I set little challenges for myself and track everything.
Laudable as it is I find the image of Thep on a rowing machine inconceivable.
So do I, now…
I’m still struggling with the image conjured up by “…pertly”.
As well you might. It’s been a while since I’ve done anything pertly. Ex-pert, you might say.
Lifestyle guru, is it you?
Yeah yeah yeah …
Tut…it’s Lifestyle G’roo, shirley
I’ve recently started swimming twice a week. I was never a strong swimmer, but I’ve had some lessons to improve my technique and now I’m more confident. It’s boosted my physical and mental well-being, so that would be my recommendation. That and cutting down on the drink, if that’s your poison. Look after yourself.
Agreed on the exercise approach.
If you are not currently an exercise person then try swimming – it’s low impact, etc etc and can be at any level. It doesn’t have to be the wild swimming that retropath mentions below – try and find and outdoor pool.
If you go at a regular time you may find there are regulars there that you can talk nonsense with after your swim. I go daily to our local pool, swim for 45 mins and spend half and hour or so solving all the worlds problems with a bunch of 4 or 5 regulars (surprisingly there are still problems in the world….)
Another fan of swimming here. As I mentioned on a previous thread, I started in March this year, having never really taken swimming seriously before. Now I swim about a kilometer 2 or 3 times a week. It’s changed my body shape and feel and 4 hours later, I am still buzzing from it and the cycle ride to work. Fellow swimmers are friendly, even the psychos who never stop apart from to time their 20 lengths non-stop will nod.
I saw a meme with some figure sitting at a computer repeated many times, each labelled consecutively ‘working’, ‘shopping’, ‘socialising’, ‘sex’, ‘leisure’, etc. And then another post saying humans are just their brains and would not notice the difference if we were in a glass jar with the stimuli supplied artificially. (the Matrix thing).
Extremes both, but I think there’s a lot to be said for ecaping that approach by getting out there and generating the stimuli ourselves that create the endorphins, dopamine, oxytocin and other hormones that make ourselves function, feel good and boost self-esteem.
Good luck, DanP. I recognize in your description of your situation some of the challenges I face in my own life. They don’t disappear by swimming, socialising, connecting, but it feels like I have more energy to try to deal with them
Thank you.
All of the above comments re swimming and exercise are valuable. Of course, the place I’m living in is the Blue Mountains of Sydney in the middle of winter. So exercise isn’t topmost of my mind. But I’ll be back in the house next week while the fam are away so will get back on my pushbike. Thank you all. Very kind and heartening words.
Walking. Gary McDonald aka Norman Gunston who suffered badly from anxiety and depression had that as his core advice.
Walk. Even 20 minutes will have benefits.
Who is gonna argue with Norman?
Agreed with what is written above…exercise at your own pace, where it’s you against your own self, is a way to feel better. Cycling, swimming, running…anything that you can do and, most importantly, enjoy interior you’re doing it will be of huge benefit.
And good to hear about you getting the bike out. Get yourself a handlebar-mounted phone holder, load the phone up with music and play it as you cycle. Don’t use headphones though as you’ll not hear the traffic behind you. Nothing like speed on a bike, music and the fresh air to make you feel good about the world.
Also appreciate those little things like the hello you’ll get from other cyclists and to speak to pedestrians as you slow down to pass.
You also say that being in nature is boring but think of it as being in nature not just looking at it. Use your bike to go disappearing down country lanes and get to know the feel of it as it goes over terrain and how even the wind affects your cycling. Then you’re feeling in the world around you, not just a viewer of it.
The moment you accept you can leave the house wearing lycra is very much a ‘I don’t care how stupid I look’ boost to one’s self esteem.
Yes, thank you.
(Except at “handlebar-mounted” I went straight to “handlebar moustache” which is a commitment I’m unwilling to make, no matter how dire the situation.)
I particularly like the idea of feeling in the world, not just viewing it.
I would have to agree. Mrs Beezer and I are going through a period of middle age dodgy health. She much more affected than me.
A commuter for the best part of 30 years my back gave up the ghost on me about 3 years ago. Very bad sciatica pointed at lower back issues. The hot bite of pain. For months. Christ it was bloody terrible. Physio sessions with the ever sainted NHS backed up with some simple regular yoga have made a vast improvement. Not only has the majority of the pain gone but my posture has improved. I stand up straight and Mrs Beezer says I’m an inch taller now.
It’s made me feel fitter and I know I look a little less of a lurching troll so I feel positive.
Which is handy because Mrs Beezer became very ill at roughy the same time. It was touch and go. But happily she remains with me and part of her long term recovery means more exercise generally. I’m convincing her that yoga stretches are worth their weight in gold. Eh?
I had a fairly lifestyle-changing diagnosis about a decade ago. I had some talking therapy to help me get used to the idea (“coping strategies”, they call it).
I found the breathing exercises and all that… fine, but what I really wanted was to play more loud music. That was difficult to do in a house where there were people working, studying and sleeping. Frustrating for me, and stress is a trigger to my ill health.
You might think I’m just a dull audiophile music nerd, but I’m really a dull audiophile music lover. The therapist asked what I would like to change to make me less stressed. You know, the “if you won the lottery” question. I said “to come home from work, make a cup of tea, and blast out an album before anyone asks me for IT support/help with homework/to cook dinner”. She said “Well, do it, then.”
So, stage 1: I bought a new hi-fi system to replace my 20-year-old collection of semi-broken kit. Stage 2: get all my records out of storage. Stage 3: build a soundproof room in my garage. This has taken a lot longer than I’d planned, but it is finally near completion. I am regenerated, and Mrs F accepts this is something I need to do to stay happy and healthy.
What’s the point of all this dull rambling? Find what it is that makes you happy, and do it. If you don’t like looking at trees, don’t do it – do something else instead. If you’re happy, your loved ones will notice it and they’ll be happier too.
Steve, that’s a brilliant comment, simple and obvious in all the right ways. I just realised that what you have described is something I have been doing my whole life. I’m also a dull music lover (but maybe not so much of an audiophile), as I suspect most people on here are. At this point in my life I am lucky enough to have a room of my own in our house that is just my space, and so my record player and guitars and all such nonsense, and it’s a sanctuary of sanity in the world.
But even in the days of renting a single pokey room in a shared flat, I would carve out a corner of that space: two big floorstanding speakers with a plank of wood across the top and my record player on top.
So yes, identify what you love, no matter how dull or pointless a hobby, and carve out a personal space for it. Sounds obvious, but needs saying.
Thank you both. As my living situation is temporary, my record player is back at home. It’s always been a safe space for me.
Funny – in my bid for more self awareness I’ve been listening to podcasts on the (now much longer drive to work) in a bid to better know myself. Today, however, listening to music made me feel so much better. Loud too.
Thank you for your comments.
All stating the bleedin’ obvious, really, but it gave me ‘purchase’: “Doc says I’ve got to get the garage soundproofed, dear, for the good of my health.”
Simplicity is the beauty of – and my problem with – self-help/improvement. You know the sort: “Do more of what you love”, “Work smarter not harder”. Like, durrr… obviously.
As a dull aside, I recently got a bollocking at work for not reading a process improvement book, as I was far too busy. I was “letting down the team” and so on. When I did, reluctantly, the takeaway lesson was “be polite to your colleagues and they’ll be more likely to help you”. So, when asked for my review by my boss, I said “I didn’t learn anything”. This was not the correct answer.
That work situation is the kind of comical situation described in the Michael Foley book I recommend elsewhere on this thread. You have to laugh at the circular irony of the friction and bad feeling caused by a book designed to minimise friction and bad feeling. I personally have a really ill feeling towards businesses paying lip service towards mental well-being etc: it’s an important topic but the way it’s rolled out in most companies and turned into a branding exercise with a target etc and all that…. ugh.
I am assuming the lead is metaphorical for the pencil of life rather than, um, the “pencil” of life. If not, see a Doc, get a talk, let bloods be checked and take the pill, which may well be blue. It may well restore a firmer line, needing no more than, um, muscle memory the next time.
But, if I am off piste and it is general well-being, my new tip for the top is the old cold immerse. Wild swimming. Of course the rivers, lakes and seas are near boiling hot at this time of year, but it still can give a hit of endorphins to shock you into wellbeing. Look online and fb for local groups: they abound all over these days, the camaraderie also a tonic. True mainly wimmin of a sturdy persuasion, but bearded chaps increasingly involved. (Othe chaps are available, but certain cliches must be upheld……)
I started at Xmas, at the tail end of a brief round with work related stress, black dog and Dr Prozac. it is magnificent at 2 degrees, but the current 18 is fine: last Friday I spent 2 hours “swooshing” down the Trent from Walton to Branston and it were fab. Not a strong swimmer, but a shorty wet suit aids buoyancy as does the mandatory attached inflatable float. If you can persuade chums or even partners to do it as well, you are sharing the joy. I am lucky in that the wife took it up first, for her chronic exhaustion and joint function ills associated with Ehler-Danlos, and it did her a poor of good, so she got me all the kit for Xmas.
No, no. Just the lead of life. The lead in the metaphorical “pencil” is fine. Living alone has certainly given me much scope for research in that department.
Two things get me back on track if I ever start to get lost inside my head; going for a ride on my bike, and not drinking alcohol. Cycling gives you exercise and fresh air and nature, and giving up the booze avoids anxiety and depression. But I think both also give you a feeling of being in control, of changing the things you can change. You soon notice the weight loss and you sleep better, and even the stuff you can’t control so easily suddenly looks more manageable.
Yep. my bike is back at the house where I’ll be returning while the fam go on holidays. Certainly the main type of exercise I’ve found closest to ‘fun’. Been Ok with the booze. Was drinking most nights before I came away to these temporary digs. Since then I’ve been reluctant to do the whole cliched ‘waking up with my face in an ashtray’ thing. So been more or less dry.
I’m generally one of life’s great mitherers and worriers, always have been since I was a kid. Often about nothing or imagined problems.
This is a source of constant pain for my wife so she bought me Dale Carnegies “How To Stop Worrying” a few years back and I found it pretty useful (I’m usually very dismissive of self-help type books).
It’s quite an old book, fifties I think, and doesn’t offer any magical solutions but it does contain a lot of common sense. Made me feel a lot better and I do tend to dip back into it every now and again if I’m feeling it all starting up again.
And what Chiz said above, I rarely drink at all these days and that does make a difference.
I’ll check it. Been enjoying The Power of Now, thought it all feels so much more easily read than actually done.
I found with reading Tolle one chapter I’d be bowled over by it thinking it was the best idea ever, then the next chapter would seem utter rubbish. If you’re enjoying a mindful approach I’d recommend (and often do) some of Russ Harris’ books (The Happiness Trap for example), which use an ACT approach. Best of luck @DanP
Thank you!
Doing is better than brooding, and doing something you like. Can be active, can be playing “tower defence” games. I reckon the latter only if you are unable to do something practical. Listen to good music, avoid toxic people, be nice, try not to let yourself go. Keep building and growing. All things will pass, everything has its lifetime.
True. Thank you.
All the points about exercise I concur with: and another added benefit is that any significant exercise (mine’s running) will make it much easier to fall and stay asleep without anything chemical or alcoholic. A good night’s sleep make everything appear a little less daunting in the morning. Running is also simply you v you, and can be done from your front door.
If we are talking actual self-help books, then let me recommend one which fits that category (sort of). I’m as dismissive of self-help literature as the next Afterworder, but this one gets marketed as “popular philosophy” rather than “self help”, which… helps.
Anyway, it’s The Age of Absurdity by Michael Foley. He’s as much as a grump and skeptic as I am, but I think grumpiness and skepticism can be invigorating in a world full of advice about POSITIVITY! and MENTAL WELL-BEING! etc. Ugh.
Anyway, his whole approach is to get back to stoicism, existentialism and buddhism, basically. Lots of quotes and anecdotes about Proust, Bergson and Beckett, and references to the myth of Sisyphus and the transcendent nature of good comedy, good company and good wine. Life is essentially, kind of rubbish, and modern life in particular is baffling and absurd, but we just have to get on with it and try and enjoy the moment.
That sounds right up my alley. Will investigate at once.
What works for one person in this regard may or may not work for another, so any advice is really just a “this is what works for me”.
I’m generally a fairly upbeat individual, but on the occasions I feel a dark cloud threatening to intervene what I tend to do is go talk to friends about it. So, that’s what I would recommend: find people you trust and talk to them (honestly) about what you’re feeling, if you’re not already doing so.
It often makes the world of difference to express out loud that thing that’s niggling you. Sometimes a weight lifts as soon as you vocalise it. Sometimes you say it out loud and realise the problem is actually a lot smaller than you’ve been making it. Sometimes a friend will just listen and give you a hug, sometimes they’ll talk you round and show you where you’re getting it wrong. On most occasions it does at least some good and will at least make you feel less alone.
If you’re not naturally a great one for talking about emotions, maybe just pick one person you really trust and ask if they’d mind lending you an ear. It gets easier with practice.
Men aren’t encouraged enough to do this stuff. We tend to try to muddle on and stoically bear the load, because that’s generally what we’ve been raised to do, and because we’ve been taught that vulnerability is weakness, when it’s actually the exact opposite. It can be daunting to go against that programming, but it’s a fantastic investment in yourself and will only deepen the relationships with the people you speak to.
Beyond that, all I can say is that you have to show yourself some love, because I’m sure you deserve it. Try putting yourself on the other side of the scenario: if a friend you loved came along and told you they were feeling the things that you’re feeling, what would you say to them? Why wouldn’t you get the benefit of giving yourself the same messages?
I have a few mates who have seen their marriages seriously wobble or collapse entirely in recent years. It’s invariably a huge knock to the self esteem, so maybe try to recognise that some of what you’re feeling is likely to be part of that process: it’s connected to the relationship, rather than to you directly, and it will pass (as all things do).
Good luck with it all. It doesn’t sound like an awfully fun place to be, but I’m sure it’s a hole you’ll find a way to climb out of. Just remember to give yourself the benefit of the doubt, and to – in the immortal words of Idles – love yourself, love yourself, love yourself.
I’m struck by the apparently contradicting sentences in our two posts:
Me (about Michael Foley): “his whole approach is to get back to stoicism, existentialism and buddhism,… Life is essentially, kind of rubbish, and modern life in particular is baffling and absurd, but we just have to get on with it and try and enjoy the moment.”
You: “We tend to try to muddle on and stoically bear the load, because that’s generally what we’ve been raised to do, and because we’ve been taught that vulnerability is weakness, when it’s actually the exact opposite.”
The truth is probably in between somewhere!
As I say above, this is very much an each to their own thing.
That said, I think there’s a time and place for stoicism, but I’m not sure a crisis of self worth is it. Not in my world, anyway.
This may be an introvert/extrovert thing.
Wise words.
Thanks to you both. Both valuable in their own way(s).
Long walks work for me. Go at a pace to get the heart rate up. Controversially, leave the headphones at home. Listen to the sounds around you, gaze into the distance. Let your mind drift. Stop for a swig of water. Enjoy the sensation of swallowing it. Breathe deeply. Couple of hours of this and I’m sorted.
Amen to fast paced long walks! I don’t feel my day is complete without one. Always puts (literally) a swing in my step.
Although I like the headphones I’m afraid.
Sometimes if it’s an audiobook I’ll just put one ear in, and leave the other ear free to listen to the ol’ sounds of nature and all that.
… Which sounds a bit weird now I’ve said (typed) it out loud.
Yes to both. I used to walk a lot. Need to reenergise.
Deffo. I am a lazy git when it comes to exercise, but I walk my dogs for about 45mins each day, which I enjoy, and they enjoy, and the wife tells me that this counts as exercise. Who’d a thunkit?
Do you have dog, @DanP? You can always offer to walk a friend’s or neighbour’s dog! Get out there and get pulled along, you’ll find yourself walking further each day and before you know ti you’ll actually enjoy it.
Woof!
As others have said, exercise. Double bonus points if the exercise is in nature. The research surrounding the benefits of being out in nature is compelling. Even if it’s a 20 minute walk, it’s good for you. My man Shankar has a good podcast about it : https://www.npr.org/2018/09/10/646413667/our-better-nature-how-the-great-outdoors-can-improve-your-life
Apart from that, I’d suggest keep trying stuff until you find something you enjoy and work from that.
I can say that I’m a believer of soldiering on, and just getting the support you need to allow you to do that. I’ve seen therapists, had meds, and neither of them has worked as well as just getting on with life. It isn’t easy, but doing that and exercising has been my pull-through. But, the caveat around support is critical.
When I’ve had depression, my wife has just been a rock for me. Right now I’m halfway through 2.5 months away from her, and the after effects of being assaulted are playing havoc with me, physically and psychologically.
Yeah, I’ve done therapy before and it was very useful. While support is important, I’m trying not to pathololgise myself – something about soldiering on is resonating with me rather than seeing where I am in my life as a ‘problem’. Thank you.
There are three things that help with resilience. Exercise is well covered in this thread. The second is spend time with good mates to have a laugh with. You don’t need to unburden your sorrows, just have fun with people whose company you enjoy. The third is a creative outlet. Do a sketch every day, learn to cook/bake, write a piece on music on this blog, learn flower arranging, practise a musical instrument, memorise all the words from a song and belt it out as loud as you can. It really doesn’t matter as long as you get a kick out of it.
As a curve ball, how about Tai Chi or Qi Qong?
Whatever you do, don’t hit the bottle. Alcohol (and drugs), under these circumstances, makes matters worse.
Yes to the creative outlet. While I was still st home, I’d written about 8 songs over the past few months of relationship turmoil. Most were shit, but that outlet to externalise was life-affirming,
“Do a sketch”: does it have to be original material or does copying Fast Show or Python skits count too?
Recreating a sketch is a creative act.
Isn’t Qi Qong that chap with the topknot in one of those naff Star Wars prequels?
For me being in my own company is mostly a pleasure and a relief from being among people. Being with the right people can be a joy but to get time to myself is a scarce treasure that allows me to recharge. Exercise is a necessary chore but I am glad when it’s over. Different strokes.
Yes, trying to find that balance. A part of me is really enjoying being alone and having my own space, modest as it is. The other side to that is the old saying “whereever you go, there you are” – sometimes feel like I’m my own worst enemy, so being alone might be exacerbating the issues. In all things, balance.
I always thought that phrase came from the movie The Adventures of Buckaroo Banzai Across the Eighth Dimension. Are you a covert Buckaroo Banzai fan, or is it just that the phrase originates elsewhere??
Yes I don’t want too much alone. I appreciate it because it is limited. You need to get away from your self too. I think some kind of group can be good. Like a book group where there’s a purpose. Learn something. Art or a language. Something in common to share and chat about.
Exercise, and, specially, running, may not be your thing, it if it is, Parkrun is a wonderful thing. Turn up on a Saturday morning and run or walk, or volunteer with a load of other people. A good friend of mine absolutely swears that it turned her life around when she wasn’t in a good place – the combination of exercise and community was a winner. There are several Parkruns in Australia and one or two near the Blue Mountains.
But, whatever. Be kind to yourself.
This seems appropriate. Upcycled colanders optional.