We’ve all been to them. Some stand out more than others.
Last night was quite memorable in that regard.Here’s something I posted on Metabook.
“I go to a few gigs and I am calling out George Lane as the worst venue I have been to in quite some time.
I’ve been there a few times and last night was the nadir.
George Lane is a small venue tucked away behind the George Hotel in St Kilda. It’s a small place decked out a la Caravan – eclectic lamps ,tables and chairs with a bar at the back and a low rise stage.
The gig list is oriented towards the older demographic and last night, Rob Snarski, we reckoned the average age was over 60. The one thing a boomer loves is a seat so people get there very early to grab the tables. And here is the catch what does everyone else do. The over flow, ordinarily stands at the back or around the sides. But the back of the venue is 2 fucking steps BELOW the main area. BELOW for christ sakes.So you cant see anything at all unless you face the other way and look at the mirror behind the bar.
Then there is the sound, ok, you’ve missed out ona table, you are up the back and can’t see a thing. At least I can hear the gig. Well NO! The speakers up the back happily played music at interval, spluttered on for a couple of songs then heonlyu thing you heard was empty bottles clattering and “3 beers and prosecco thanks mate”
I dont know what they do- fewer tables, smaller tables and chairs, reconfigure for overflow around the sides, build a raised false floor by the bar- it is a very high ceiling, video screen at the back, have the sound system playing out the back obviously. But my tip is, if you want to actually see or hear anything get there at doors open.
Special shout out to the $29 margherita pizza with virtually no tomato and 2 basil leaves – effectively a round toasted cheese.”
The Astoria and the Mean Fiddler Mk2, at the top end of London’s Charing Cross Road were pretty lousy. Now both gone to redevelopment and bloody good riddance.
The Astoria was on its last legs as a venue for at least the last 30 years of its existence and it’s a wonder it lasted as long as it did. You know the sort of place with a very sticky carpet? The Astoria had sticky everything, every surface, and made you go “ugh” internally however good the band were. You felt like you really needed a hot shower as soon as you got home.
Odd that.
I have lots of happy recollections of the Astoria, never thinking it any more of a dump than lots of other London venues. It was also dead convenient as I has a fighting chance of getting the last train at Charing X.
I always liked ‘faded grandeur’ venues like the Lyceum, before it was done up for The Lion King, but have particular recollections of the T&C bogs being horrendous & being almost ankle deep in pee – worse than old school footy grounds. Gross!
me too, seemed to be the place in London where most of my favourites played and I always think of it fondly. Still a jolt on the very infrequent occasions when I’m walking up Tottenham Court Road and then it’s not there.
On your way to see your agent, Raymond Duck?
No he was four floors up on the Charing Cross Road and never a job at the top of them…
I’m the same. When I worked in central London, it was my favourite place to go on a work lunchtime and buy tickets with cash for face value, for a gig a few weeks later… (puffs on pipe) ahh, them were the days!
The Astoria had a narrow stairwell running from the main floor area that was a disaster waiting to happen if a fire had occurred. But I saw some brilliant shows including Smashing Pumpkins on their Siamese Dream tour, Wilco touring YHF, Teenage Fanclub (twice) and Fountains of Wayne. Sound was always good and the floor no less sticky than most other venues of its time.
Jealous of you seeing FOW.
I was a fan from ‘Radiation Vibe’ onwards, but sadly never got the chance to see them.
I’m sure it’s been mentioned before but The Astoria was also the venue for a series of Noel Gay TV shows in the 90’s that never aired (as far as I know). I saw a stack of shows there for my £1 donation & enjoyed Vic& Bob, most of the Fast Show gang, Curtis Mayfield, Alexander O’ Neil, Mark Thomas, Jack Dee & Dennis Leary amongst others. Good cheap fun!
Ha Ha! Not only are you jealous of someone seeing the FOW, but that was a cracker of a show. The next time they played in London (at the Scala maybe?) they seemed to be going through the motions…. although even a slightly lacklustre performance couldn’t dampen ‘Red Dragon Tattoo’!
The one I wish I’d seen was the Islington Academy, featuring David Mead and Squeeze on the bill…
I am now more jealous than ever, but I’m delighted to hear it was a belter!
It seems almost the ideal venue to see them play – pretty small & standing up.
I bought a live DVD of them (Chicago, maybe?), hoping for a lively gig – they played well, but the atmosphere was non existent – the audience seemed terrifyingly clean cut, lots of Brads & Janets in very neat chinos & polo shirts standing still with their arms folded.
Awful!
Maybe it was my era but I never expected any more of a venue. I was happy to be able to get close to the bands I loved, sweaty and home in under an hour.
The Astoria may have been filthy, but I was fond of its location: it was also the venue for legendary 1980s acid house club night The Trip, which I tried and failed to get into on two occasions.
Bristol, England has The Station – a repurposed Fire Station – which consists of a large open space, big enough for, oh, probably five or six large Fire Engines. It has a bar at the back of the space which stashes its empties in those big trundly, trundly plastic skips, just close enough to the pumps and optics to facilitate the bar staff’s indulgence in a loud glass-bottle-lobbing-contest all evening, and there’s a stupid little stage up front that’s at least 8 or 9 inches high. Oh, and the toilets are a row of plastic portaloos, out back in the enclosed car park.
Things may have improved since my last vist there, to see Sara Watkins, Sarah Jarosz and Aoife O’Donovan (a.k.a. Im With Her) pre-Covid, but I vowed never to go to the venue again, even if Gerry Rafferty launched his comeback therein.
Yep , that’s a shit venue.
There is something similar in Bournemouth – the Old Fire Station. I had the misfortune to attend a gig there some years ago. Facilities were pretty non-existent, a grotty bar at the back with bar staff who talked, laughed and joked throughout the band’s set. There was a delayed start due to some sort of staffing issue, and the audience had to stand outside in the street for an hour. Let’s hope they have managed to turn things around, but I won’t be making a return visit.
Fairly local to me, but I’ve only been there once. It was a good gig: John Grant. I can’t remember much about the venue really.
Drove past there yesterday. Looked OK on the outside.
Always had my doubts about the cliches of how great gigs in little clubs are. The band comes on too late, there is nowhere to sit, there is endless jostling to see what is going on, it’s far too loud, it’s about drink sales and blokes with busy bladders and prostates are back and forth to the grotty bogs. I used to see gigs at the Marquee. That was a shit place, too.
I spent many happy hours seeing bands at the Marquee in the early 80’s. It was just about the perfect size and shape. Being fairly tall means that I’ve got more choices of where to stand than lots of people. The bogs were indeed grotty but they often are at bigger venues as well!
Union Chapel. I can’t be entirely critical but it’s the fact it could be so much better that annoys me. I may be ‘old’ but I prefer to stand. That’s not allowed but I’m sure they could make room for a small standing area for those that want it. To add insult to injury, the seats you’re forced to use are hard… very hard. So, I get there to see the support band, nip off to the toilet on the interval (did I mention I was old!?) then, as I’m normally on my own, the seat’s gone by the time I get back!
Pretty much the only thing it has going for it is that, because beer isn’t allowed in the auditorium, once the gig starts, there’s not a constant flow of people going to and from the bar.
Taking a cushion to the Union Chapel is an option, I agree about the hard seating, which also marks that that seat is taken when leaving for micturation duties.
The Queens Hall in Leeds was a converted tram shed which still had the tram lines in the floor. Cold, unpleasant and dirty luckily no longer there.
Practical suggestion Hubes but taking a cushion to a club gig. I am not sure I could do that.
Inflatable cushion?
Quit these euphemisms – we’re all grown-ups here. It’s a rubber ring, isn’t it?
A well padded jacket that could be placed discretely under one’s bottom is as far as I am prepared to go.
Inflatable cushion I do have a rather natty 60s inflatable cushion which most certainly is not a rubber ring for those suffering from the Chalfonts.
Generally speaking, leaving your coat in your place on the pews, while you go for a wazz, is a surefire way of retaining your place at the UC. The biggest problem is that the space between the pews is so narrow that everyone in your row has to stand up to let you pass. That acts as a security feature though. If somone was to nick your coat they’d have to ask everyone to stand while they made their getaway.
It’s a terrible venue for bands with drummers, I’ve found. Has an echo that goes on and on forever. Sensational for choral music though and the chapel’s Henry Willis organ is one of London’s wonders.
You can stand at the back in the Union Chapel. Just behind the soundboard so you probably get optimum sound.
I have done so when driven from my seat in pew 3, at a Ron Sexsmith gig, by a drunken actor (you will have seen him in many bit parts over the years and his name is not dissimilar to a star from the Golden Age of Hollywood) whose response to my requests to keep it down was to tell me to eff off and then offer to see me outside.
As it’s a fairly small venue, you are not far from the stage. I was not asked to return to my seat and enjoyed the rest of the gig immensely.
Bloody Barry Pooper… always been an arse. Dean Jelly on the other hand… total gent.
Carl. I need another clue please.
Are you asking me not to forsake you?
@Vincent
Only ever went to the marquee once – to see Steve Hillage in the summer of 78 (bits of the show are on Live Herald). Couldn’t believe how tiny the place was once me and my three mates got inside. Or that we actually got inside at all given that we’d driven down from Hull without having any tickets
Driving down from Hull in 1978 must have taken about three days.
Don’t worry, M, we stopped off on Hessul Ruhrd for refreshments in order to gird our loins en route…
Yep, I was at that one, too. After a few bitters and bifters, standing up is optional. I also saw Tom petty, brand x, Hanoi rocks, the Enid, and a few others there. Loved the music, but the heat, sweat, volume, jostling … not so much. I’m not a fan of clubs and discotheques anyway, so it won’t work for me. A standing venue with something to lean against may work (the O2s in Birmingham and Leicester work), but there is competition for such spots.
I love Union Chapel, but there and bands which do and don’t suit the atmosphere. We always take seat pads (standing at gigs is shit and always has been, regardless of age). To my mind, unless you can get in the first 3 or 4 rows in the nave you’re better heading to the steeply banked pews upstairs, especially the ones directly behind the row they leave free as a walk through.
We went to the Aotea theatre in Auckland a few years back, my wife had booked tickets to see a ballet/dance thing based on the music of the Shangri Las. Where we sat it sloped backwards at such an angle that all you could see were the heads of the people in front and then the upper bodies of the dancers. Fortunately after the interval the people in front of us had got so pissed off they didn’t come back so we did have a better view for the second half. Still couldn’t see the dancers feet though.
And we went to a couple of big theatres in Auckland as well which don’t have cloakrooms for some reason. So if you’re going there in winter you have to sit with your coat folded up on your lap, is this normal in other countries?
This last is perfectly normal. Yes it’s a pain in the arse. Sit on my coat? Put in in the dubious void beneath my seat? All equally unattractive options.
“Coat”? You big Jessie.
Well, the white opera scarf looks daft draped over an XL black t-shirt.
Coat?
Seat?
Bloody luxury!
Did I ever tell you about the three day drive down from Hull to see the Hurdy Gurdy Man at the Marquee with only a poorly recorded tape of Rainbow Dome Music to entertain the three of us?
Bloody hell, I bet you had to go through a few rounds of Ten Green Bottles on that trip
DONOVAN?
Most of them. Wembley Arena-shithole, Hammersmith Palais-sticky floors, sometimes violent atmosphere, Astoria-see Wembley, 02-some seats in a different (higher) post code etc In London I like Royal Festival Hall
The sticky floors were especially bad news if a well-aimed punch put you down on the deck for the count. You needed three strong men to get you back on your feet again.
Agreed. I saw New Order in the Wembley pool in 1987 and avoided it until I had to chaperone Offspring the Elder there in 2019. 32 years later, it was still awful beyond words.
I can clearly remember sitting up on the side at Wembley Arena (The Jam, I think?) and hearing the sound coming out of the PA stacks by the stage on my left and bouncing back off the back wall away to my right.
I saw the Mothers of Invention and Ike and Tina Turner at the Festival Hall, which was a surprise given I’d gone to see the Royal Philharmonic Orchestra.*
*joke
I remember arriving late for a Wendy Cope reading at the Festival Hall and being ushered in hurriedly by staff, only to find ourselves staring at a full orchestra about to embark on a classical performance.
A friend has just posted that he went to see Soft Machine last night, the gig was moved from The Brudenell to Leeds Irish Centre. All well and good, however the back raised part of the hall had been booked for a private party and although blocked off the sound of the disco could be heard through the concert.
He thought that it should have been billed as Soft Machine and Disco.
Why, Why, Why Are We Boogieing
Reading Hexagon. Too big for the club circuit, too small for the O2 circuit. And acousticly suspect.
Stranglers and Squeeze have been recently, but at 30 quid a ticket, it’s overpriced too (much like the beer)
There was a venue above a pub by the river in Cambridge, which burned down a few years ago.
It used to be a cinema, so I had high hopes. It had a house PA, a proper stage, a huge bar across the back of the auditorium. But, in order to maximise the bar area, the (huge and expensive) mixing desk was in an alcove, on the the mezzanine floor above the stairs, at right angles to the stage. So the mix engineer could not see the stage or hear the PA.
I only did one gig there, with the wife of the guitarist shuttling back and forth saying “the drums are too loud”, “singer has picked up his acoustic”.
If the police want to find potential suspects for the arson, they should start with every live sound engineer who ever tried to mix there.
@fentonsteve weren’t you mixing from your iPad? “Ducks”
Can you imagine what a Soundcraft iPad would be like?
Steam powered?
I attended a couple of gigs at the Cockpit in Leeds, but was let down by awful acoustics, leaving both before the end. The problem was most likely due to the venue being set inside a railway arch.
That was The Dark Arches when I was a spotty student in the late 80s? Pretty grim then too, if so
Village Underground in Shoreditch also suffers from poor sound due to being about as tall a space as it is long. Went there once to see Shuggie Otis and was not impressed.
The recurring element in this thread is the hubristic idea that you can turn absolutely any building/space constructed for any purpose into a suitable venue for rockaboogie ding-dong music. Just whack everything on full, what can go wrong?
….er, everything
If you’ve never contracted a combination of trench foot and frostbite from an evening spent listening to a slurred assemblage of noise masquerading as music then you’ve probably never been an audience member at a gig held at The Deeside Leisure Centre Ice-rink. Truly awful and I report this as someone who spent more than a few evenings at Erics in Matthew Street trying to work out what exactly that smell was.
…. the earthy smell of raw talent?
It was a ‘mystery smell’ it was certainly raw, rambunctious, sleazy with a hint of stale fermented fish spunk.
The sweet essence of giraffe?
You must know some very odd giraffes.
I went to few there (Whitesnake and Rush a couple of time each as I recall), before someone left a pinball machine switched on overnight leading to an electrical fire which managed to burn down an ice rink. It was an awful shed of a venue.
Yes, the Deeside was my first thought too. Wasn’t that another venue with a floor more suited to crown green bowling?
Saw The Who there in 1981. Can’t remember too much about it, was the first “big” concert I ever saw and naturally I was on the rail at the front (at least for a while). Remember cars being smahed up outside maybe a Mods and Rockers thing?
In this age of high ticket prices and brand loyalty in music (who is going to say an act that has just cost them £200 – and a train fare and a baby-sitter – was lousy? – too much invested), the answer to the question “What was the show like?” is always (well, 99.9% of the time) “Oh, it was brilliant.”
The proprietors of music venues know this.
Much maligned, often for good reason, football fans are usually far more discerning. No, really.
I pick venue first – pros and cons of the football/rugby/cricket match second. You’d be amazed how often the lesser game on paper turns out to be the better game anyway.
My nomination: Stafford Bingley hall. 10,000 people stuffed into a cowshed in the middle of nowhere. Only accessible (as a 17-year old) via a coach and ticket combo from Piccadilly Records. Can remember on The Jam’s final tour terrifyingly packed waves of people flowing back and forth.
An actual cowshed is used at the Bath and West Showground, at that Shepton Mallet. Is also used for various events like antique fairs, but it is a large cow shed.
Bingley Hall was an actual cowshed. Saw Bruce there 1981, not the best venue but best show I ever saw nevertheless
I saw B twice on that tour.
The first time a Manchester Apollo, one of my top four.
Meant passing up on the Spurs – Man City FA Cup final replay in which featured Villa’s Sublime goal but no regrets.
My nomination too.
I saw the first ever gig there – The Who in 1975.
Harvey Goldsmith came on stage before support act, The Steve Gibbons Band. He opined about the venue “I think it’s a winner. Which I am sure he thought was absolutely spot on. Cow shed. Nothing to incur any overheads. Big crowd. Herd them in. Don’t give a toss about comfort, sound quality, facilities generally. Count the receipts.
The worst venue I’ve ever been to is the ‘Bierkeller’ in Bristol. Saw John Shuttleworth there. He was inaudible and invisible, both due to the concrete pillars. Sticky floors, vile.
Christ, yes, that was a hole. All the acoustic sublety of a shipping container. I saw Big Country there, and quite a few others of their contemporaries. They all sounded the same. Which is saying something, given the distinctive skirling tendency of the Scottish band.
It had a basement refectory vibe with low ceilings. I saw Galaxie 500 there and The Sundays.
Forget Tutti Frutti. Forget Robbie & Emma. The Beach Ballroom Aberdeen 1875. Geno Washington and his Ram Jammers giving it all at Volume 11.
Volume 11 not enough to drown out the noise at the bar or the sound of head on nose as yet another unfortunate sank bloodily to the floor. Mayhem, violence and drunken carnage at the back whilst at the front a nervous teenager who had somehow blagged his way past the terrifyingly threatening bouncers thought “Crap acoustics, my ears hurt cos it’s so loud, no idea how I’m going to get out of here alive but this is my place, my place “
1875? He’s aged well, hasn’t he?
Festival Hall in Brisbane was a godawful venue. It had history (the Beatles played there) but was primarily built as a boxing venue with the intended position of the ring in the middle, which meant that anyone in the stalls on the side had to sit with their head angled almost 90 degrees to see the stage. Add to that an apparent lack of any air-conditioning/circulation that meant the atmosphere would not be acceptable on a cattle boat.
And then there was the sound quality: lots of parallel sides, underneath bits and a cavernous ceiling meant that the place was a giant bass trap, with colon-bursting frequencies reverberating endlessly. Was probably not a problem for the Beatles in 64 playing through their dinky little Vox AC30s, but when I saw the Red Hot Chilli Peppers there in the early 90s, I literally could not differentiate any songs (insert joke here) and my main memory is of Anthony Kiedis spending half the time sucking on oxygen from a cylinder beside the stage. Even Crowded House, who I saw in ’86 just before they released their debut album, was reduced to a pulpy sonic mass.
It got torn down some years ago to make way for a set of apartments (Festival Towers) and I, for one, wasn’t losing too much sleep over it.
“Was probably not a problem for the Beatles in 64 playing through their dinky little Vox AC30s”…. Well that and the fact that nobody could hear anything except screaming. And that was just for Des O’Connor.
Venues in Dublin are all pretty damn good. Only exception is the National Concert Hall (think Lomdon’s RFH) and is too sterile devoid of rough edges to have any kind of atmosphere.
For acoustics, I have been to no worse that Southampton Guildhall. Dreadful sound, every time.
As others have mentioned Wembley Pool/Arena pretty awful, never liked the NEC arena either.
I used to love the Astoria that others don’t like, managed to see the Stones there. For me I’m a “smaller the better” man fnaar fnaar – Kasey Chambers at King Tuts Wah Wah hut is one of my gig highlights.
Also saw The Stones at the Astoria, small shows for them are always memorable, but I actually preferred the Twickenham performance a few days earlier
Smaller not necessarily better according to my opening piece.
Like that garage where there was just enough room to cram the drums in the corner over by the Dodge.
That woman yelling “turn that down” is the bassist referring to one of the monitors.
Newcastle has the Riverside which is always chronically over-sold and the University, where the stage is so low you’re lucky to see the tops of the bands’ heads.
Its a new Riverside, isnt it? (Actually on the riverside).
The old one was small but fine.
Yeah used to be Sea nightclub
Been to see Gang of Youths and The Coral there in the last month or so. Crap venue with the only toilet upstairs, (having to push past the packed crowd to get there) but the old Riverside was great. Won’t be going back.
I remember the old Riverside as one of the sweatiest venues I’ve ever been to.
Massey Hall in Toronto is a fantastic venue, has about 4 levels. Only bathroom is (was) In the basement where the only bar is (was) also situated. The queue at half time was crazy. I would leave the venue and go round the corner to Yonge St and have a quick beer in a pub there and a leisurely piss. Still be back in good time for part 2.
* They have spent about the last 3 years renovating the place so I hope the bathroom/bar situation has improved.
Ah, the toilets. Forgot about those. Always bray my head on the ledge above the urinals. Seen a couple of fights in there due to frayed-tempers caused by the over crowding.
Oft mentioned here, mainly by me, I think the Royal Albert Hall sucks. Looks lovely. Nice to be in. Sounds like your artiste of choice is singing through a flexible shower hose underneath a few inches of bath water.
Hammersmith Odeon. I don’t think it’s a bad sounding venue but I’ve been struck on more than one occasion by the grotty damp looking concrete floor and the pervading whiff of urinal cakes. And no, I hadn’t inadvertently took a left turn and sat in the Gents. This was in the auditorium.
I was actually going to piggyback this thread and ask about the Royal Albert Hall, funnily enough. There is a concert in November for the 50th anniversary of Tubular Bells (the second “50th anniversary” show and the album is still only 49 years old… which I don’t get…) and I was considering coming down to London for it as they aren’t touring it anywhere up north. It’s got an orchestra and Brian Blessed as the compere, so sounds like fun and it’s one of my favourite albums.
Tickets are £40 for the upper upper circle bit. Am I just wasting my time, do you think? Is it really bad for sound?
Mind you, if there’s anyone who can fill the Albert Hall on his own by sheer force of voice and personality, it’s Mr Brian “King of the Hawkmen” Blessed.
Go. And enjoy the whole experience.
Just expect a bit of wooliness.
Lower floor only. If you are up in the gods then not much of an experience, I have found it to be fine on the lower level.
Hurrr
Oooh, I was all set to buy a ticket there but now you are giving me cause to doubt. How much of a deal breaker is it not to be on the lower levels? Ticket prices really jump up the lower you get, and I was looking to do this on a bit of a budget.
Och, you know what? I’m just going to go for it. It’s the bleedin’ Royal Albert Hall so it will be an experience if nothing else. Never been to it before.
(You can tell I’m not very decisive. Bane of my life).
This is the correct decision! Must admit I haven’t been there for a rock gig for years, but I have seen a few there in the past, including some where I was sat up in the gods, and always enjoyed them – seen Van, Clapton, and Paul Simon there amongst others. Whilst of course it suffers with acoustic challenges as any large venue does, it is still an amazing auditorium to experience.
Do report back. I haven’t been this century but the PA system has been replaced since, and possibly some of the mushrooms on the ceiling. I seem to recall DaveBP and I discussed it on here at the time, probably pre-Drupal.
The spec can be found here, https://thirdlight.royalalberthall.com/file/26506910637 page 13
TLDR: there’s a lot of strategically place d&b line arrays and they’re using high end digital desks. I haven’t been for years but I’d expect the sound to be pretty good now.
I have to say, as a non techy, that’s a fascinating document of which I comprehend approximately 3%. (Much similar to your comment above, the 3% coming right at the end, when the civilian language kicks in) I suspect young Steve has it memorised already. Fair play to you both. It’s witchcraft, I tell you.
*Rubs thighs*
I use (some of) the same microphones as the RAH. Which is nice.
*Rubs Steve’s thighs*
I use some of the same cables. Allegedly.
Yes. Correct. Go. It’s an iconic venue and worth the experience of just being there.
This is true. Last couple of times I was there I got tickets through the artist (Ron Sex-smith, supporting Nick Lowe) or from a friend who gets complementary tickets sometimes (Brooooce!), naturally both were in good areas and the sound was great.
GRAND PIANO!
TUBULAR… BELLS!!!!!
MIKE’S ALIVE!!!!!!!!!!!!!
Exactly! I think he’ll be perfect for it. He’s also doing the “caveman” bit on Side Two apparently, which will be… interesting.
They are also playing Ommadawn, so we might even also get his rendition of “On Horseback”? Who knows.
A tip: if they are opening up the seats behind the stage, they are surprisingly decent, and give an interesting view of the onstage activity. Good for watching what the musicians are doing, rather than just the frontman’s face. (Which you won’t see)
When you first mentioned this I thought it might be a recreation of the original Queen Elizabeth Hall concert from 1973. Quite a few of the original musicians are still alive and performing. But I’ve read this is a purely orchestral concert, with an album release scheduled. Is Mike Oldfield involved at all?
No he’s not involved. A source of much consternation and debate among the online Mike fan community. He’s basically just gone quiet for the last five years or so since his last album, despite quite a heavy (for him) social media presence at that time, talking about this Tubular Bells 4 (so to be honest, maybe we’ve dodged a bullet there…).
That’s two completely separate ’50th anniversary’ shows he has had nothing to do with (apart from a brief press release statement in support of that other show last year). And, as I said above, both strange in that the 50th anniversary of the old Bells is next year. I should know: I’m almost exactly the same age as the album itself. (Not down to the actual day of release: that honour goes to Space Ritual, an album I’ve never actually listened to…) If Mike was involved I wouldn’t be so indecisive. I (not so) secretly worship him and the music he made in the 70s.
Thanks for the info. @Arthur-Cowslip
For Oldfield personally, there must be a huge amount of mental baggage about revisiting the original TB release. One can understand, perhaps, if he wishes to keep some distance from anniversaries, although he seems much more relaxed and at ease with himself these days, and has immersed himself in endless TB projects before.
I wonder if we will see any new music from him again. I seem to recall that we had slightly different takes on Return to Ommadawn. I was dismissive, while you saw some positives. Is it an album you have returned to? Do I need to revisit and give it another chance? I’ve found most of Mike’s music since the 90s to be polished and professional but oddly sterile. It’s a bit of a cliche when discussing his output to say that that the urgency and vitality of his best 70s work was lost post exegesis, and I don’t think it is entirely true. Crises, Amarok and Songs of Distant Earth still get their turn on the hi-fi. But I was hoping for some kind of fundamental reset with Return to Ommadawn, and it wasn’t to be.
I have to confess I am pretty much of the exegesis-cliche crew. There did seem to be a definite line drawn when he finished up Incantations and went off to New York to do a disco single! And if you are going to draw a line anywhere, the exegesis session seems to be a pretty accurate place to draw it. But who knows. Life doesn’t fall into these neat patterns, does it?
No, Return to Ommadawn was definitely not a fundamental reset. I can’t really defend it strongly, hand on heart. I like listening to it, and have returned to it quite a few times, but I would describe it as “pleasant” or “nice” more than anything else. It’s the same guy, and he’s getting old but still has guitar skills, and the sound is warm and inviting. If you heard it without knowing what it was, it might just sound like background new-age-y type guitar music with a slightly ethnic feel.
There are two little bits in particular on side two that I do think evoke the spirit of his seventies stuff and give me a little shiver (hard to describe as it’s instrumental, but a couple of minutes in when the choir comes in, and then the start of the first coda bit towards the end with a solo acoustic guitar). Better than Guitars and Songs of Distant Earth and all that, but nothing earth-shattering.
I saw a few things in there back in the mid-90s and gave up after a horrid Human League gig where, despite being front row of the circle, we couldn’t hear anything but mud*.
The best bit was buying the Viz Human League In Outer Space t-shirt from the merch table afterwards.
I haven’t been back since the PA/acoustic upgrade a few years back.
(*) They didn’t even do Tiger Feet.
That’s right.
Jokes like that you’re gonna be lonely this Christmas, B
Nah, that gag was dynamite
A new nomination. That purple area in the middle is Focus playing, right now as I type, in A-Canteen, a cafe bar in Chelmsford. It’s a low -ceilinged room with a tiny stage and a brutal drum sound. We’ve retreated to another part of the bar for the second half as my ears were taking a battering and it’s not like we could see much from our seats anyway.
Focus as in the Hocus Pocus hitmakers?
The same, allowing for line up changes over the decades.
A cafe -bar, Thijs Van Leer and Jan Akkerman both in the band presumably? What a travesty.
Thijs yes, Jan no. The changing line up can be found on their Wiki page – https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Focus_(band)
It’s an odd one this. A-Canteen not usually a band venue, and having been there for a gig now I can see why, though they sometimes have comedy and cabaret nights. The gig had been rescheduled 3 times due to Covid (including once when Thijs was in hospital for non-Covid reasons but tested positive). When it was first announced for a date last November it was at very short notice, less than a fortnight. I can only conclude that a booking agent just phoned around any venue they could find where the band could squeeze in a gig when they were already in the east of England.
Most of the shows they have been playing here are Arts Centre type venues seating 200-400. Come to think of it, if they had been able to play the Civic Theatre in Chelmsford it would have been about the right size and a much better venue for a show. We might have been able to see them from our seats for a start, though we would have lost the option to retreat to a comfy sofa in the room next door if the volume got too much.
And what nice shoes you have.
I’m going to stick up for Wembley Arena, although it does depend where you are I suspect. For the Beach Boys 50th tour 10 years ago (blimey!) and Steely Dan/Steve Winwood 3 years ago we were in similar seats up the side of the stage. I thought the sound was fine. The beer and the bogs on the other hand….
I was in the first 6 or so rows for The Stones there in 2003 and it was excellent, even got a high five from Ronnie when they made their way to the small stage in the centre of the arena. Still a shitty venue though in general, though I believe improvements have been made since.
People in Virginia rave about Wolf Trap.
It’s open air, and wooden seating if you aren’t on the lawn.
Sound sidyllic? Nope. 98 degrees, with very high humidity do not for a good night out make.
Similarly here in Blighty, the Crystal Palace Bowl.
Sounds like a Roman amphitheatre, doesn’t it? It could be, were it not for the lake between audience and stage – it gets rather wet in the mosh pit. God forbid it rains on gig day.
I think a roof is the very least we should expect from a venue! Interestingly, I went to a gig in Austin, Texas that (effectively) only had three walls so the venue was nicely (and very naturally, air conditioned. It had been a scorcher of a day but in the club in the evening, it was just right.
Man has walked on the moon, but two things in life never improve in a scientific sense: 1) umbrellas, and 2) the sound at gigs.
Gigs are either too loud or totally muffled. I saw Echo and the Bunnymen a few years ago, and Ian McCulloch could’ve been speaking Welsh for all I could understand him.
In terms of worst venue, I’ll give a shout for the old GMEX in Manchester: a soulless cavern. Even if you were standing in the front row, it was still better to watch the gig on the big screen at the side of the stage.
We should maybe start an alternative thread for those venues where the sound IS good at gigs! My nomination would be the Glasgow Royal Concert Hall – never been to a gig there where the sound has been anything less than exemplary.
Your description of the GMEX sounds like the SECC in Glasgow – ugh. (NOT the SECC Armadillo – that’s a separate bit and is quite good actually).
Everything I’ve ever seen at the Sage Gateshead, from West Side Story to God Speed You! Black Emperor, has sounded great. Sadly, it’s got all the atmosphere of a waiting room.