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For the first time ever, Northern Ireland has advantages…

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Perhaps people here who are Scottish or Welsh have grown up feeling the same, but being from NI, it’s certainly always been clear to me that the place has been an embarrassment and annoyance to successive UK national governments. It’s impossible to avoid the feeling of being second-class citizens when travelling on ‘the mainland’ – or when ordering goods online that are supposedly delivered ‘anywhere in the UK’ (Shetland et al.) only to find that that means ‘except NI’. National newspaper deals too – ‘free Sherlock Holmes books with this voucher (except in NI)’ etc. Oh, and we have a load of local banks that are somehow allowed to issue their own bespoke “sterling” notes… except that nobody ‘on the mainland’ accepts the bloody things. It might as well be toy money.

In short, I have for my entire lifetime been embarrassed by Northern Ireland and felt second-class when among people in England/Scotland – embarrassed because its most prominent public figures are a shower of bigots or terrorist apologists (DUP & Sinn Fein), because its biggest claim to fame is a boat that didn’t work (Titanic) and that now, unfathomably, drives tourism here, and because its currency is useless elsewhere in the UK – try and present a Bank of Ireland / Ulster Bank / Northern Bank note at a business (even try to change it at a bank) in England and you will be looked at like you’re a con man.

Most people in GB, I’m sure, don’t want NI and don’t understand why it’s still there – or why it was ever there in the first place. Weirdly, it’s probably ‘still there’ because of an entrenched, loud minority in local politics who, bafflingly, REALLY REALLY REALLY want to keep belonging to the club in which every other member wishes they’d just quietly go away.

But for the first time ever, post Brexit – aside from having been able to say that you’re Irish when travelling in Europe (because it seems broadly true that French, Spanish, etc. people don’t like the English) – it looks like there are advantages to being born / living in NI, for businesses and individuals. How about that?

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-northern-ireland-55488686

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Comments

  3. ā€œMost people in GB, Iā€™m sure, donā€™t want NI and donā€™t understand why itā€™s still there ā€“ or why it was ever there in the first place.ā€

    I mean this nicely – honest! But to be perfectly honest I doubt if many people in GB without a stake in NI give it any thought at all. At least, not before the whole brexit debacle. And even now, I donā€™t know if it impinges any more on the average Brummieā€™s day than, say, Cornwall does. People donā€™t really work that way!

    Iā€™m reminded of something Iā€™ve seen people say about London – that They (the horrid Londoners) Hate Us (the noble people of Real Britain, esp. the North). Itā€™s not at all the case. I doubt anyone in London thinks about Scotland or the North or wherever at all, because like everyone theyā€™re just busy living their lives. Just human nature.

    Members of the perceived in-crowd never see themselves as any such thing: itā€™s only ever members of the self-perceived out-crowd who are even aware thereā€™s an in or an out in the first place.

    But Iā€™m pleased for NI. It seems like after decades and centuries as a battered political football, thereā€™s now concrete benefits associated with being from NI, and thatā€™s got to be a good thing for you. Hope you enjoy!

    • You are, of course, correct Hedgemeister! I should have added caveats like ‘most people in GB, if asked the question…’ or suchlike – or ‘most Westminster politicians in GB’, because the nation as a whole is within the remit of Westminster politicians, so it’s incumbent on them to have a view, even if that view is ‘I’ll not bother thinking about the blasted place unless I’m drafted on to the NI Affairs Committee’ (yes, there is one!) or, worse, ‘unless I’m made Secretary of State for NI’. Actually, one recent one – a lady whose name I now forget – had almost no idea about the place. She stated in one interview that she had no idea that unionist people voted for unionist politicians. Breathtakingly incompetent.

      • Karen Bradley was the politician in question. She actually said “I didn’t understand things like when elections are fought for example in Northern Ireland – people who are nationalists don’t vote for unionist parties and vice-versa,”. Even worse her “excuse” was that the comments were taken out of context, which is hard to see as being actually true.
        Mind she wasn’t the worst SoS we’ve had recently – surely Theresa Villiers should get that accolade. The only half decent one was Julian Smith who was instrumental in getting the Assembly back in work, but of course then got sacked by BoJo for alleged disloyalty, to be replaced by the current puppet.

    • ā€œMost people in GB, Iā€™m sure, donā€™t want NI and donā€™t understand why itā€™s still there ā€“ or why it was ever there in the first place.ā€

      That’s an Anglo viewpoint. Most of us in west central Scotland ken fine. And feel like 2nd class folks in our own land.

      There is no United Kingdom. Only England matters.

      • Occasionally one hears things on the BBC TV news that seem telling, like the anchor person saying, ‘Well, that’s the case the case in Scotland. What is it here?’ – I heard that last month. It’s as if ‘here’ – on a supposedly UK-wide news context – means ‘England’.

        • It’s part of the culture I grew up in. That otherness. Not quite one of us. I felt it on holiday in England in the 60s.
          The England 66 team played under the Union Jack and not a single voice was raised that I know of.
          When did you ever see a newspaper from outside England (The National press as they call it) being reviewed on the telly news unless there has been a disaster in that “region”.
          I’m turning into McGlashan, even starting to look like him.

          • I’m sure all of us on the AW from the ‘Celtic fringes’ of the UK have many great friends in England – and people who would never display knowingly, or at all, the ‘otherness’ vibe of some in England. But I think the ultimate problem is that Westminster is basically ENGLAND (and those other bits, in tinier font than this). In an ideal world, if the UK had to continue existing, the happiest solution on paper would be a devolved parliament for ALL FOUR of the UK entities… and some additional all-UK body above that. But in practice, it would be far more pain than it would be worth – financially, legally, logistically – plus the Conservative Party would never agree to such a thing in principle, because they just wouldn’t see or understand ‘the problem’.

            But it’s academic anyway. The UK will begin to break apart within the next 10-20 years.

  5. For what it’s worth Colin I began a relationship with a Belfast lass this year so have spent a bit of time there when travel has been permitted (I live in Edinburgh). I fell in love with the place pretty quickly and that’s before I’ve even managed to enjoy any of its pubs, theatres, museums, galleries, restaurants etc. and I can’t wait to explore the rest of it when I can.

  6. NI May have benefitted from the Brexit agreement in so much that it is still closely aligned with the EU and will, hopefully, prosper from that relationship.

    I recently had a conversation with an ageing, Catholic uncle in Glasgow. He is convinced that the two Irish nations will become one.

    There will always be Unionists, but in the long run do you think there is enough elasticity and will – politically and with religious tolerance – to accommodate a wider Union?

    • I feel that it’s inevitable NI will become part of the Republic of Ireland – or at least, that its constitutional position will change in some way towards that/away from GB. That change may be tortuous and painful, or may surprise everyone and be easier than anticipated.

      Ultimately, it comes down to a popular vote within NI – a principle that I think all sides accept. NI only came into being (in 1921) via a kind of uber gerrymandering – six out of the nine counties of Ulster being viewed by unionists as ‘holdable’ in terms of the religious split – for a while, Donegal (one of the other three) was in consideration as part of what became NI. I doubt anyone now denies that there was gerrymandering of the constituency boundaries within NI for decades to retain that unionist dominance.

      ‘The Troubles’ essentially began on the back of a civil rights movement, protesting at the societal and employment inequalities of people from a Catholic background. That movement was hijacked by nationalist militants, but their job was made a thousand times easier by the blatancy with which peaceful marches for justifiable rights were attacked by the likes of Paisley senior and his gang of bigots, and the perception that law enforcement was turning a blind eye.

      I loathe the bloodshed on all sides, and I personally don’t care one iota about the sovereignty of NI one way or the other, but dispassionately, the Troubles were if not entirely a product of decades of unfairness towards one community by the representatives of the other in power, then the powder keg was massively stoked by it.

      Put simply, ‘Catholics’ outbreed ‘Protestants’ so at some point a referendum in NI about sovereignty will be lost by those who prefer the status quo. It may takes some years after that, but the de-UK-ing of NI in some way will be only a matter of time after that.

      • An Irish friend of mine said we should use the terms “Irish” and “British” when discussing the situation rather than the religious denominations. Those being a by product rather than the main thing.

        • Historically, though, the religion of one’s birth, or one’s perceived religion by others, has been the problem – not one’s *chosen* identity. I used the ‘C’ word above (and the P word) because it was specifically that difference that affected the housing, employment, etc. opportunities of people… which led ultimately to the Troubles. It may surprise people in GB to know that, even now, if one is applying for ANY job in NI one has to fill in a form stating your religion or your perceived religion. Yes, even now. In the past, certainly into the 90s, it was the case that if you didn’t do this or opted for ‘Other’ or whatever, you had to state your primary school – and then someone else would decide what religion you supposedly were!

          • Wow. I will bow to your (much) greater local knowledge. Never been to Northern Ireland myself, thought about going to Belfast a few years ago to get an overnight ferry to Liverpool, but in the end opted for a Dublin-Holyhead one instead (my first proper visit to that part of the island).

          • Yes. I remember talking to one of our many members of staff from Northern Ireland just after she started and talking about our recruitment policies and the need to monitor staff diversity. ‘What, you mean like are they Protestant or Catholic?’ was her natural and immediate assumption.

            • Yes, it’s astounding, isn’t it? I’ve known people who have moved away simply because they can’t stand the load of s**t that is involved in getting a job here. And I don’t blame them.

              • I used to live in Switzerland, on the annual taxes form you were asked what your religion was. You were allowed to leave it blank though. Switzerland being a country that also has large catholic and protestant sections. No sectarian violence there though. In fact not much violence for 700 years, see Orson Welles in The Third Man.

    • Or indeed without Dave McLarnon’s Hat Band and their now legendary set of five Ulster rock classics – Peacefrog, Adventures, Energy Orchard, Rudi, Them – in March 2020 – the Last Gig Before The Apocalypse:

  9. Great post Colin. How ironic that Northern Ireland is the bit of the UK that can continue to enjoy many of the benefits of the EU. The passport thing is a big deal of course. My English daughters have never been more pleased that I am from Northern Ireland; one has her passport application in already, and the other is just waiting for my papers to be returned so she can apply. They remain incandescent and bewildered at this country’s self inflicted removal of so many of their rights.

    I’ve never been embarrassed by Northern Ireland, but have despaired of the bigotry and most of the political leadership. John Taylor is just the latest to make an eedgit of himself (again). Mostly I have had the rose tinted spectacles of an exile, my family having moved away when I was 15. And taken pleasure and pride in sons and daughters like Van (of course), Seamus Heaney (the greatest English language writer of my lifetime INHO), Brian Moore, Bernard McLaverty, Brian Friel, Lisa McGee, Barry Douglas, Stephen Rea, Adrian Dunbar (who didnt float down the Lagan in a bubble), Amnda Burton, Mary Peters, Pat Jennings, Willie John McBride, Darren Clarke, Martin O’Neill, Eddie Irvine, et al.

    Will it end up as part of a reunited Ireland? Probably. Much of the rest of the UK is, as you say, completely ignorant about Northern Ireland and doesn’t care. Thats what Brexit has shown – that the Conservatives are no longer the party of the union, and the left look down on the country as simply a bunch of neanderthal bigots. They’d all be happy to be rid of the country and see 1.5m people as an inconvenience rather than equal citizens of the UK.

    • I had no idea you were a Van fan, Bluemeister… šŸ˜€

      Do your daughters know that they can also, of course, play soccer for NI? šŸ˜€ Indeed, even they only had an NI grandparent they could do so…

      NI is really a sort of inconveniently close version of the Falklands vis a vis GB – a historical curio from the colonial era that every UK government would really rather be shot of, but the people who live there keep demanding to stay attached…

      I never understand why Conservative govts, especially, keep banging on about ‘the union’ – it has always seemed clear to me that it’s basically a Home Counties party that couldn’t give a damn about anything north of Watford or west of… well, wherever – Salisbury? Bristol?

      Scotland will go first. Economically, it’s probably unwise, but morally it’s inarguable, in my view.

  10. Another overlapping irony is that Brexit accelerates the process of the reunification of Ireland. The irony being that the Conservative and Unionist Party were the loudest supporters of Brexit.

    I had a good friend whose family lived on the Falls Road in Belfast and I spent wonderful week there in the 80s as a guest of the family. I was nervous about it because TV painted a picture of it as a grey, grim, dangerous, permanently bombed out and barricaded no-go zone. It wasnā€™t like that at all. Remarkably, we had beautiful weather for the whole week.

    The family consisted of five adult brothers and a mum and dad. On the Sunday, three of the brothers took me along to mass. This was a ritual I was familiar with but to my delight we gave the church a swerve and had a few pints instead. The youngest brotherā€™s job was to pop his head round the church door – see which priest was taking mass – and pick up a newsletter. When we had dinner later on, the mother asked who the priest was and the correct answer was given.

    While we were in that packed pub my friend said that itā€™s probably wise to stick with them because no-one will have a problem with me being English as long is it can be clearly seen that I was with them. When it was my round, I got up to go the bar and the youngest brother was told to take my money go to the bar for me – just to be on the safe side. It only takes one, they said. Otherwise, I felt quite safe. Would I have gone for a stroll around town by myself, though? No.

    Itā€™s fair to say that the family considered themselves Irish so they didnā€™t particularly see themselves as being part of NI as such.

    There doesnā€™t seem to be a strong movement to establish NI as an independent nation, fully separated from the UK and Ireland – with no links to either of them. I wonder if NI would be viewed differently if there was such a movement?

    • Don’t for a moment mistake me for a person sympathetic to the Tories in any way, but didn’t the Conservatives stop calling themselves The Conservative And Unionist Party some years ago?
      Aren’t they just The Conservative Party now?

  12. Great post Colin, and I’m pleased for you. I’ve spent a fair amount of time in NI over the years, and have rellos in Derry – pleased for them too, particularly the young ‘uns. It would be interesting to know what the feeling is among the population at large about a United Ireland – there must be plenty of non-hardline protestants who have come to see the logic of it.

    • Well, I saw some research a couple of years back showing that if all of the people who regularly DIDN’T vote in Westminster elections voted for a ‘None of the Above Party’, that party would win EVERY SEAT IN NORTHERN IRELAND bar one – West Belfast (Sinn Fein).

      A very substantial number of people just accept the sectarian carve-up every election and don’t bother, assuming nothing will change. But eventually it will. Quite how may yet be a surprise. Let’s hope so.

      The reason I make periodic protest songs/videos (with no problem whatsoever in recruiting great muso pals to the cause) is because I can’t just sit by and just shrug my shoulders year in year out and watch bigoty, incompetence, cronyism, arrogance, greed, corruption and the infuriating waste of public money that could do so much good in so many ways were it not p*ssed away on cack-handed stitch-ups with chicken factories and Ulster-Scots claptrap.

      ‘Smash the System’, ‘Northern Ireland Politicians’ and whatever the next one is called are almost certainly futile gestures, but I can look myself in the eye and know that I did what little I could with small resources to shout ‘Enough of this sh*t!’ as loudly as I could.

  13. I first visited Northern Ireland (for work) in 1993, and a fair few times since then. I have to say, in all sincerity, that it is the friendliest place I’ve ever been. So I’m fond of it.

    There may well be gravitational pull between NI and the Republic now, however I have an alternative suggestion: merge NI and the west of Scotland (approx. the old Strathclyde regional council) to recreate the ancient Kingdom of Dalriada. This would have the happy effect of removing from rScotland (Pictland, perhaps) most of those who define their cultural identity in terms of religion and the associated football.

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