I write this as a founder member of the club.
Just heard a banger of a song, a Daft Punk track for transparency.
The drummer was doing a full Mel Gaynor, the keyboardist had at leat six different keyboards on the go, the guitarist shredding and widdly-widdlying.
The bassist (if there even was one) meanwhile was playing the occasional note , probably an open E, maybe a G. He might occasionally have caught the guitarist’s eye to check something about “same key, I think.”
So, how do Root Note Plodders get away with it?
Sometimes a root note plod is all the song needs.
Exhibit A: Waterfront.
It surely can’t have been Mr Forbes on this?
But yes, it fits.
Yes, if I correctly remember the recent Minds biography I read, it’s Mr F with an effects pedal or two.
I feel Adam Clayton is offended by this thread.
Exhibit A m’lud. But it actually works I feel.
I think Adam would be the first to say he’s the least technically able of the Luminous Times (Hold Onto Love) Hitmakers.
On the other hand: Two Hearts Beat as One; New Year’s Day; Lemon; Some Days are Better Than Others; Even Better than the Real Thing etc
I don’t accept the premise of the question. Shame?
You play what’s needed for the song – sometimes “root note plod” is what’s needed. I find I’m playing fewer notes as I get older – less interested in showing off, I suppose. Playing nearer the fretboard as well – and flatwounds rather than roundwounds…must be age related!
I think my post is more a reflection on my abilities than anyone else’s.
I was definitely the weak point in my band at school where it was all about technical show-offery. We knew no better at the time.
Ok, Fitter – how did you get inside my head?
I think basses should have a loop of barbed wire around the neck, somewhere around the ninth fret. The stuff I’ve been asked to do as a guest musician, rather than making up stuff as part of a band, has usually been the simpler stuff.
Spooky…
https://tinyurl.com/yppvw36b
Atmosphere and balance, I guess. A few notes for emphasis can be just as effective as lead bass burbling. (DOI: I can only play “air” bass, so haven’t much clue beyond what my ears tell me.)
Funny you should ask. I have recently, to my great surprise, become the bass player in an old-time fiddle-and-banjo band called Fiddle Faddle, here in God’s own country of northern NSW. 3 or 4 fiddlers, occasionally 5, one banjo player, couple of mandolins, any number of guitar and uke players, even a zither occasionally, although nobody can hear it. A recipe for disaster, you might think, and it’s up to me to hold the whole thing together. I can only do this by root note plodding two to the bar, four to the bar, whatever, with the occasional run up or down to stop me going into a trance. Getting too fancy quickly earns me a scowl from the boss. ‘This isn’t fucking jazz,’ the banjo player said to me once. So yes, root note plodders have their place.
I must be the one person in England who doesn’t like Van Morrison’s Astral Weeks, and my main beef is there’s too much jazzy nonsense going on with the bass. Compare the tight economy of the playing on Into the Mystic with the frenetic four-string spankery on Sweet Thing. I’m with the root note plodders.
Actually you aren’t the only one. Richard Davis was the bass player – he played with Eric Dolphy on Out to Lunch, also with Stan Getz, Ahmad Jamal, Kenny Burrell, Roland Kirk, Earl Hines…the quintessential jazzer, in fact. Great player, but I’d much rather have heard, I dunno, Jack Bruce, Carl Ladle…
You’re not alone. I try once a year to find the key to it. 10 years on I’m still none the wiser about the apparent greatness of it. Some good songs, but I don’t get “something” that makes others declare it a masterpiece
Above it my Van Can-on: Moondance, Tupelo Honey (only for the title track really but what a title track), Into The Music, Veedon Fleece. So yes I enjoy listening to it, but it’s not the holy grail for me.
I’ve said it before but that won’t stop me: Astral Weeks is a great hangover record. As I’ve been teetotal for the last decade, I’m unlikely to listen to it again.
Peak Van for me is the Caledonian soul stuff: Saint Dominic’s Preview. Tupelo Honey, His Band and Street Choir and Hard Nose the Highway. If I want “introspective” Van, I go for Common One and Veedon Fleece.
Not the only one. Too much aimless noodling about. And I like aimless noodling about.
11 minutes, three notes.
Depends on the type of music dunnit? Anything too showy offy doesn’t float my boat anyway but maybe that just reflects my tastes, which veer towards punk, post punk, a bit of indie etc. Some of the best bass is percussive repetition anyway like in a fair bit of rockabilly or the Elvis Sun Sessions.
I remember a muso, or maybe a producer, talking about Roger Waters, saying that when it comes to the bass he might not be in the top flight of players, but what he does have is a great sense of timing – when writing songs, he knows just the right moment to change the bass note/thump/beat/whatever. If you’ve got that sort of knowledge or feel, you probably don’t need to be a virtuoso.
I think this being generous to Rog. Many of the bass parts on Pink Floyd records were played by David Gilmour, and Water’s playing live is pretty ropey. It could be said that both his slack bass and Nick Mason’s rolling drums contributed quite a lot to the loose exploratory nature of their early 70s sound, but they didn’t half get lazy and recycle a lot of parts.
Just out of curiosity- what was the Daft punk track? Asking for a friend
I don’t really understand premise of your question. The root note is all. It’s everything a song or melody is based on. Do you mean sticking to one (root based chord) without change?
I play lots of standard and open tune stuff on guitar and more often than not drop the low E whatever I’m doing to ensure the piece is firmly tied to the root.
Am I overthinking this?
Yes. 🙂 To hear bass playing that’s NOT just based around the root notes, go and listen to The Who “Live at Leeds” or any Yes album. It can be great in the right hands, but admittedly can get tiring. It very much depends. Things like the aforementioned With or Without You or Pink Floyd’s Careful With That Axe Eugene depend very much on the bass player staying in his box and not doing anything remotely fancy.
You might be overthinking it and so might I!
Basically, I’m a very average bass player . I can work out bass lines from songs pretty well somehow but I’m hopeless at writing bass lines or improvising or jamming. If a guitarist played a E chord I’d play an E on my bass. If a guitarist played a F chord I’d play an F. Etc.
I do recognise less can be more sometimes. I guess essentially I’m jealous of inventive bass players.
I do actually quite like plodding too…
Whenever the conversation turns to bass playing I feel I have to mention John Taylor on Save A Prayer. Blimey it’s good…
Yes. He can really play, which is something that seemed to get lost beneath the yachts, pastel suits, etc., but has since gained more attention. JT definitely brought plenty of funk to the New Romantic popinjays.
Old, but I’ll just leave this here.
See rule 8.
I agree with 9 out of 10, Twang…
Which do you disagree with?
I bet it’s number four, the dirty perv.
Number 6. Sometimes you need to play your old flatwounds with a pick and a bit of muting, or you’ll never get that authentic Carol Kaye sound.
True. I never do that mind, but I’ll allow it in this case.
Hope your prejudices aren’t leading you to miss out! Perfectly legit playing style. Also, you’ll never get an authentic Chris Squire sound/feel without a pick…
I’ve even used fingers and pick in the same song!
Actually I do occasionally use a pick. I’m just messing with you. I don’t like the sound much, too edgy, but you’re right, sometimes that’s what you want.
Not too edgy if you’ve got old flatwounds on, tone knob about halfway or less – and you’re palm-muting while you pick. That’s a definition of “thump”…
Yeah my P Special has flats. Well, technically I think they’re half round (or half flat I guess). Plus I have the “bit of foam”, an essential tone tool.
‘Course, there’s always the option of Dad doing the “curly wurly” part (i.e. far too elaborate), while junior bass must be as unobtrusive as he can:
Just because a bassist is playing root notes doesn’t mean he/she can’t swing.
Just thought I’d mention that.
Absolutely. Surprised nobody’s mentioned playing root notes behind the beat either.
Both implied, shurely?
If you can’t swing, you probably weren’t inspired to play bass in the first place.
And where you place your notes also depends on how you play with your drummer.
Being a Root Note Plodder I have no idea what you mean by playing behind the beat. Just about understand Swing.
Wish I’d never written the OP!
This may or may not help.
I’m a root-plodder. It’s a while since I’ve played in public, but all the musicians I’ve played with have been vastly more accomplished than me, so there was never any point in trying to be Pastorius; ‘cos I couldn’t. I think I could do a lot of John McVie lines, but not John Entwhistle.
I love Colin Moulding’s playing, and can just about do some of his more complicated ones, though he’s such a melodic player, while in his words glueing the other guitars and drums together.
Most bands don’t want Pastorius. A solid unflashy bass player who keeps the groove is worth their weight in gold.
Root Note Plodders usually get the gig because their dad has got a van. Absolutely vital to the survival of a band.