For quite a while the only version of New Order’s Theives Like Us that I knew about was the instrumental version tucked away on a b side somewhere. When I eventually heard the full version, I was shocked at how a perfectly good and, dare I say it, bangin’ tune can be destroyed by a vocal track that sounds as if it was made up on the spot by a drunk at your local karaoke bar. It was like a tragically misjudged BBC move to add an Ed Sheeran vocal to Match of the Day. “Oh yeah it’s time to show some football…”.
It’s really, really hard to imagine well known “proper” songs without their vocals. Perhaps Every Breath You Take’s bassline and percussion is enough to be a great track? Probably not – it does seem like a “bed” for a warbler in chief, in this case, Mr Sting. Money Changes Everything is a lovely instrumental by the Smiths. Johnny Marr used if for a single with Bryan Ferry, who added lyrics and called it The Right Stuff. You remember how that goes, eh?
But what about Relight my Fire by Take That? Remove the vocal and it’s much, much better. Save a Prayer by Durran Duran – sod off Simon, it’s fine!
I’m running out of battery life so I won’t link It but Dave Clark (not that one) released an acoustic version of a Depeche Mode song, Dream On. No vocals – just the main groove of the song played on an acoustic guitar. Occasional noises float in and out. It’s much, much better than the original full song.
You may use this to insult a singer you don’t like – but the point is to find songs that didn’t need a vocal after all.
TBH, off the top of my head I don’t think I can think of any track in particular where I prefer the instrumental version, rather than the version with the vocal. Of course I could think of a load of tracks where I’d just like to remove the vocalist cos he’s rubbish, but that’s different. However, I must disagree with you in the strongest term about Thieves Like Us with the vocals, as of the 130,000 or so tracks I have in my ITunes library I’d place the extended version of that track in my top 10.
I love Bernard’s vocals and his lyrics, because they are a bit shonky (although his vocals have got better with age), but I think they fit the vibe perfectly. They certainly called out to the teenage me and they have done ever since. Thieves Like Us, as is the case for several New Order tracks, is in that rare group of songs that always feel fresh to me, no matter how many times I listen to them. The instrumental versions are good too, mind, but I much prefer them with the vocals.
The instrumental version on TLU was the B-side of their early adventure into sampling, Murder.
The B-side of the vocal version was Lonesome Tonight, one of their best ever songs.
How I wish they’d stayed split up after 1993…
I did hospital radio shows in the late 80s and I used the TLU instrumental quite a bit when reading out that week’s top 10 illnesses.
Re: “…when reading out that week’s top 10 illnesses.”
And we have a new entry at number Nine, straight in with a bullet – St. Vitus Dance!
That was by Men Without Hats IIRC
Jazz.
My criteria for buying jazz is (a) “when,” and (b) “does it have a vocalist.”
If the answer to (b) is yes, I don’t buy it.
Fascinating.
Lots of great jazz this last decade. In fact, I’d say it’s comparable to the fifties and sixties for brilliance. And vocal jazz is at the forefront. These five are amongst the best albums of any kind in the last decade and are in with a shout of making my top albums of all time:
1. Melanie De Biaisio – No Deal
2. Zara McFarlane – Arise
3. Melody Gardot – Currency Of Man
4. Jason Moran – All Rise: A Joyful Elegy For Fats Waller
5. Kurt Elling and The Branford Marsalis Quartet- Upward Spiral
I love vocal jazz as long as they don’t get all soully. Soon as the melisma, faux emotion and over souling starts I’m out. I had tickets to see a”jazz singer” at my local jazz club but one look at You Tube and I gave it a miss.
spot on
Are we talking Cleo Lane territory? If so, yuk.
Far worse.
Skiddly bop.
Oh dear. This is serious.
Scat in both senses of the word
I can’t tolerate a whole lot of vocal jazz, but Blossom Dearie and Peggy Lee absolutely get a pass.
@deramdaze, your “no vocalists” stipulation would exclude Ella Fitzgerald. Are you mad?
“I put a disc on to his hi−fi, my choice being Billie H., who sends me even more than Ella does, but only when, as now, I’m tired, and also, what with seeing Suze again, and working hard with my Rolleiflex and then this moronic conversation, graveyard gloomy. But Lady Day has suffered so much in her life she carries it all for you, and soon I was quite a cheerful cat again.”
Quiz time! Where’s that quote from? Eh? Eh? A prize of Colin McInnes’ novel Absolute Beginners to anyone who knows.
Erm … is it from “City of Spades” by Colin MacInnes?
So, so close. But no. And while I’m here, I’ve just noticed a bit of a giveaway blunder I made earlier. Walked straight into a bear trap. So the prize isn’t whatever I said it was, it’s now a different book entirely. Or something else, not necessarily even a book.
Stab in the dark – is it Colin MacInnes’ Absolute Beginners? I’d like something else, please
One top quality tupperware fingerbowl on its way to Langedoc.
Do I get half a point for “City of Spades”?
‘Fraid not. But if it’s any consolation, I really, really wish you did.
Are they the original draft lyrics to U2’s Angel Of Harlem
No. But you win a dog for trying. Please arrange collection.
Ella Fitzgerald is EXACTLY what I’m thinking of.
Old hat.
Might as well bung in Frank Sinatra and his crowd.
That’s what, mercifully, Rock ‘n’ Roll destroyed … until the 60s dodgers (Bono etc.) got busy.
🤣
You’re funny.
Oh I know what you mean. Like Sibelius, he’s so old hat too, isn’t he?
Sibelius’s songs without vocals on are all right though.
Another Sixties dodger, what do you expect? Fuck him and his ringtone!
That’s a book I’ve been meaning to read for years and you just reminded me. Cheers!
I think it’s very clear by now that he’s mad, isn’t it? Who else gets that worked up about who deserves a magazine in their honour?
Worked up?
Are you George?
If you’re referring to the Paul Simon Uncut, I simply asked “will anyone buy this?”
No one bought any of the 6 issues of the CSNY one in my local shop, and there are still all 7 of the Paul Simon one on the shelf.
So, kinda “no.”
No offence, but a dodger, yeah?
You see; mad.
No vocal jazz? Gale Moran maybe worth avoiding (she never added anything to Chick Corea, IMHO), but Ella Fitzgerald?
Welcome – if a little late – to the party, @Vincent 😉
I’ll just put this here.
Didn’t even have to play it to know exactly what that was!
I get there eventually. It took me 35 years to ‘get’ Captain Beefheart.
That wasn’t quite what I meant, Vincent.
Scroll up a bit.
My favourite version of Please, Please, Please Let Me Get What I Want is this instrumental take by the Dream Academy as featured in Ferris Bueller’s Day Off. The vocal version features dreadfully weedy vocals. I like that it makes the lovely tune that bit more epic than the Smiths original…
My thoughts strayed to The Smiths too. I am on the side of the room that thinks Morrissey has been one of our great singers, so it’s not for reason of trying to banish his vocals. It’s not quite the same as being better without the vocal, but I can think of two ‘songs’ that could stand on their own instrumental legs : This Charming Man and Barbarism Begins at Home.
The Trevor Horn Band regularly play Two Tribes – a song I’ve never liked – as an instrumental. He explains in advance that he regards it as a slice of prog rock and he should know. It’s much better than the original. Sorry but this is the best clip I can find.
I’m beginning to think this thread was set up deliberately to wind me up! The Annihilation Mix of Two Tribes (with vocals!) is also one of my 10 favourite tracks, whilst The Dream Academy (see above) are one of my favourite bands, with Please, Please, Please… being one of my favourite tracks of theirs. If someone chooses and instrumental version of a Sophie Ellis-Bextor song next I’m going to have to go and sit in the corner of the room with my fingers in my ears, going ‘la, la, la, la, la,,,’
When I am on Desert Island Discs, the Annihilation Mix of Two Tribes will be on my list and I will refuse to do it if they won’t play the whole track.
How many tracks are in your top 10? 😉
241
Well I tell you what – Murder on the Dancefloor would be much much better if….
I’m joking! I’m joking!
That’s excellent. As you say, could have easily fitted into “90125”.
I mentioned this on another thread recently, but when the tune to Richard Thompson’s Persuasion first appeared on the film soundtrack Sweet Talker I found it pleasant enough, if unremarkable by his standards. It was later coupled with a lyric by Tim Finn to become a song which I’ve never liked. I find the lyric rather wish washy and that … pause gets on my wick a bit. It’s a hugely popular song with the RT fan base though, and one he still plays at most gigs so I just have to wait out a few minutes before something more to my liking comes along.
The instrumental version of the Floral Dance by the Brighouse and Rastrick Brass Band is, shall we say, slightly better than the version with Terry Wogan’s “singing” on it.
“Both amazing”, is what I expect you meant, Duco. But yes, the non-Terence version is superior.
That’s a perfect example.
I will also weigh in with Anyone Can Fall in Love by Anita Dobson. I’m not saying that the Eastenders theme is sacred or wonderful, just that it didn’t need a version with a vocalist.
Maybe not better, but better than one might expect.
I think where you have long rock pieces which are mostly instrumental, vocals can seem a bit of an unwanted intrusion or something that you need to get out of the way before you get to the good stuff. Don’t bore us, skip the chorus. Even with something like Shine On by the Floyd, singing Shine On You Craxy Diamond as a chorus feels kind of banal and crude compared to the brilliance of the extended intro and what comes after the singing.
Hot Rats the title track only takes off when the Captain shuts up. He does all right though,. As far as vocals on Zappa records go his efforts are majestic compared with the usual sung material. I generally avoid Zappa with vocals.
Last Gaga’s album “Artpop” wasn’t great, but the instrumental version weirdly is really good.
I gather disc 2 of the double disc edition of the new Pet Shops Boys album is a straight instrumental version.
Yep, and it’s jolly good.
Is Dub Music instrumental versions of ‘vocal’ songs? If so, most Dub trounces the original.
Re: “If so, most Dub trounces the original.”
Listen to Tigger on this point.
There was a good instrumental version of “Give me back my man” by the B52’s on an NME tape I recall. It might have just had the backing vocals? Anyway, I liked it.
The genius of Brian Wilson
I’ve always preferred the instrumental P.E Squad/Doo Doo Chasers to the vocal version on Funkadelic’s ‘One Nation Under a Groove’. Just a slice of greasy funk that can be enjoyed without the scatological chanting. This was on a bonus E.P that came with the album, and I also prefer the live Maggot Brain version on this to the original.
Similarly, Kool & The Gang’s Jungle Jazz:
I have that ONUAG with the EP. Good call on Maggot Brain!
On ‘Too Long In Exile’, Van Morrison has an instrumental called ‘Close Enough For Jazz’.
I prefer this to the versions he’s added lyrics to. Can’t remember which albums, the lyrical versions are on, but they’re much more recent…..one of them is on the duets album I think. Persil or daz haha.
Until I read your post, I did not know The Man had an album called Too Long In Exile (way too long, way, way, way too long, all the way back, way back, on the ancient, ancient, highway, etc. etc. zzzzzzz).
I do however know this song with lyrics and it’s great. I also cannot remember which album it is on.
I am increasingly a civilian.
Also, on that album cover, is that Van in the mid distance? Dosen’t look particularly ancient.
What was he doing there?
I just had a look at my cds. The tracks including vocals are not on the ‘duets’ album. One is on ‘Born To Sing no plan B’, and there’s another on the album with Joey Defransesco.
No info about ‘To Long In Exile’ covert art, other than that it’s by Berenice Abbot.
Apropos @tiggerlion above, is dub vocal free? A: clearly not, but I do enjoy the Mad Professor’s workings of Massive Attack, No Protection. And the League Unlimited Orchestra sometimes hits the spot more than Dare.
A lot of Dub is vocal free and any voices that survive often become little more than part of the backing track.
..and my favourite version of “say hello wave goodbye” is without the vocal.
Underworld’s “Rez” is much better in the original instrumental mix than “Cowgirl”, the vocalised equivalent on the album.
Good call.
One of the places I’ve heard quite a few records without the vocal (although I suspect they’re just mixes of the instrumental parts of each song rather than a complete recorded version) is on the goal packages on Match of the Day. Whatever they did with “The Life of Riley” in the original Goal of the Month segment was tremendous.
It’s a very good question in the OP…
I’ in agreement with previous posters: I’ve always thought that two of the best-known Morrissey/Marr tunes – This Charming Man and How Soon in Now – are so strong instrumentally that using a different lyricist/co-writer could still have resulted in a well-known song.
See also Are ‘Friends’ Electric?, Soft Cell’s version of Tainted Love (bit of a cheat, I know), Teenage Kicks, Town Called Malice…and Goal of the Month without the Life of Riley instrumental is just wrong.
I wondered if Jimmy Page was having a little pop at Robert Plant by releasing a few vocal free mixes on the recent (I’m old, everything is recent) remasters.
I think the strongest candidates for instrumental Zep are probably Rain Song and Ten Years Gone, neither of which has been officially released without vocal, but this take on Going to California is lovely – delicate and intricate
He probably is having a dig at Robert, for refusing to prop up Jimmy’s career by hampering his own and agreeing to another LedZep reunion.
I’d like to nominate Supper’s Ready on Genesis’s Seconds Out. Pity actually, as the band is just terrific and offer, with various drummer constellations of Chester Thompson, Bill Bruford, and Phil Collins mighty powerhouse versions of their greatest hits up to then.
The problem is Collins: a terrific drummer, no question, but he was “tasked” with filling in the vocals of Peter Gabriel, as heard on the Foxtrot album. In fact, Collins fell into this role when the band discovered he could hold a tune quite well. Dear Massives, you’ll all know his idiosyncrasies, having heard him on many radio hits throughout the 80s.
The noise that gets me, and renders Suppers Ready unlistenable, is a certain EOW! he uses. It’s very similar to one of Spike Milligan’s RP-diphthong-loaded silly voices, and has absolutely no business on a progrock live performance. Execrable.
Yeah, I know, first world problems.
Phil Collins and Peter Gabriel’s voices are in different ranges. PCollins natural singing voice is much higher. Absolutely fine when both were present in the band as the two voices harmonised well. An overall improvement in the vocals, actually. I’m sure when they recruited Collins it was his voice as well as his drumming that got him the gig. After Gabriel left, none of the old Gabriel-sung repertoire really sounded right with Collins’ voice leading.
That’s interesting because I think Collins and Gabriel have similar singing voices. I can totally “hear” Pete singing (say) Follow You, Follow Me or Phil singing Solsbury Hill.
Have you heard Nad Sylvan – the singer Steve Hackett uses on his Genesis tours? I think he has a wonderful voice – pitched somewhere between Collins and Gabriel – that brings something new to the whole picture.
The vocals on Trick of the Tail – the first album without Gabriel – seem especially tailored to Collins’s range and style. Not sure how Gabriel’s more raspy voice would fare on tracks like Ripples or Mad Man Moon, for instance, but I wouldn’t mind hearing his efforts.
Nah, Collins has a much thinner spread in his vocal “chords”, if you will. Gabriel can hit the same notes but has a depth of inclusive lower notes in that sound. I dare say there is a musical term for this. Probably italian, del forno, con pesci or some such.
“E Pericoloso Sporgersi”, possibly?
trans//: ‘My hovercraft is full of eels’?
*chuckles*. I knew ‘pericolo’ was ‘danger’, and have looked up the rest.
But he left the accent off the “E”! I mean, honestly! I dwell among heathens.
I don’t speak Italian, but I know that in French, for instance, when a-grave (à) is used as a capital letter, the grave accent is omitted. So the correct form would simply be A, rather than À.
But Italian is probably different.
Most of the French language is, I believe, made up on the spot.
La défectuosité obtiennent mon manteau.
So true, Gary. It’s no wonder that Gallic Jazz has a certain je -ne-sais -quoi.
PG’s vocal nuances, timbre, accent, inflection, articulation, phrasing, pitch range, control, dynamics and pitch accuracy are way better than PC’s. However, PC is more able to sing a high harmony and if the song suits, PC’s is perfect on its own.
Yebbut..
it’s not about Collins’ voice, which is okay. It’s that bloody noise he makes, like a sigh, like Milligan. Don’t you know it?
CBA to look for examples..
Nigel Farage was better without the vocal today. The embarrassment is only mitigated by the fact that we won’t see him there again:
love this