They are ‘pre-emptive’ pardons, to prevent any chance of the vindictive incumbent going after the people concerned. It’s moving into Minority Report territory, but it’s legal in the land of the free, apparently.
At least Trump’s first day passed by quietly. Withdrawal from WHO, exit from Paris climate accord, pardons to Jan 6 rioters, border emergency delared, plus a lovely nazi salute from Musk etc etc
All these presidential “executive orders” from either Trump or Biden seem to be fundamentally undemocratic.
As Dame Marina Hyde points out “The day marked a personal tipping point for Trump, who has now pulled out of more international agreements than Playmates.”
Never really understood the love for Marina Hyde. I wish her no ill, but how she’s become the darling of the liberal media is baffling. ‘Dame’ isn’t that far off: she’s the daughter of Sir Alastair Edgcumbe James Dudley-Williams, 2nd Baronet. She’s also ‘good mates’ with Piers Morgan (he left his wife for her) and has never had a real job in her life.
Journalist? Yes, of course. Columnist? No. Not in the context of doing 38-40 hours per week in any job, let alone a physically demanding job you hate. We always hear that British productivity is down: if Marina can revive the economy with her 500 words per week, I’ll accept it as a real job – as opposed to the sneering whimsy of Piers Morgan’s one-time bedfellow.
You have a very narrow definition of ‘productivity’ and of work itself.
I work in mental health; I don’t really produce anything of economic value. If I’m lucky, I contribute to the marginal improvement of someone’s well-being. Is that even a real job…probably not, by your definition.
And do you target this ire towards all columnists, or just the ones you don’t like?
I saw the Jeffrey Bernard is Unwell play (the Peter O’Toole version was on YouTube). I’ve also had a few drinks in the Coach and Horses – the pickled egg behind the bar was rather inspiring in its menace.
Well, I don’t really like any of them, so it’s not difficult!
I’d say working in mental health plays an invaluable part in the economy; I’m several thousand miles away from being an expert, but if you’re facilitating the mental health of workers an the wider community, you’re a thoroughly good sort in my eyes.
Don’t understand the beatification of Marina Hyde either.
She’s a classic Guardian toff who writes snidey hit pieces on easy targets, always playing to the gallery. Essentially the Regina George of the chattering classes with a slam book to match (see, this stuff is easy).
Her work these days always feels a waste of time; it scratches a bitchy itch best left ignored, it never tells you anything you don’t already know, and it’s awfully, awfully pleased with itself.
I’ve grown a little bit weary of her schtick lately, because, recognisably, that’s what it is when you get down to it.
That said, it’s not a bad schtick, as columnist’s schticks go.
Her schtick – see also John Crace in the same paper – reaffirms and comforts her fans’ views week in week out. The comments under each of her columns, span the gamut from sycophantic to the fawning, everyone gets a chance to get really, no, really quite angry indeed! Some will call Tories/men/Trump/Musk “utter cockwombles” again and everyone’s happy.
Still, it’s not a bad schtick as Mike says, and it’s pointless expecting Hyde or any similar columnist to venture out of their cosy comfort zone. I know its not easy knocking out 800-odd words of crowd pleasing prose weekly but post Brexit, post Farage/Reform, post Trump, post-everything, to me it just feels a bit feeble and predictable. She’s as predictable as the likes of Allison Pearson, Rod Liddle or Melanie Phillips are for the other side.
Reading Hyde’s column takes you further away from understanding what’s going on, partly because it’s empty calories, but mainly because her gaze will go wherever Trump and co direct it, since she can’t resist a social media friendly zinger. Hyde is part of the circus we all need to learn to look beyond, constantly groping for “engagement”, constantly falling into the same traps as a result.
I took a look at her piece about the inauguration this week and it was exactly as you’d expect. Musk’s odious salute in the opening, plenty of material on Lauren Sanchez’ bra (presumably more than can be said for the bra itself), and a short throwaway para towards the end on the Trump Coin, the development which one suspects all this cabaret is designed to distract us from, and to which Hyde gives little thought. The salute and the bra will be chip wrapping next week, but overseas interests will still have a channel to funnel crypto payments to the President of the United States.
Exactly as you say, it’s lovely to get together with like minded people and chuck creative pejoratives around. It probably has some therapeutic value, and maybe people need that. But it doesn’t help you understand anything – in fact it only takes you further away. What we need to get better at is figuring out how to pick our way through the bullshit, rather than luxuriating in it because it’s great soap opera and grist for the mill.
Seems a bit reductive to me. I’m not relying on Hyde to shape my views of Trump or any other major news issue. Plenty of other trustworthy sources for more serious analysis.
But there’s a role for satire, mockery and general piss taking as well. It’s often quite powerful. I think it’s OK to have both. Maybe some people just rely on the piss taking, but I think that’s on them.
I’m not sure who to reply to with this comment, so much has been said above in a mixture of subthreads – this isn’t really a reply to fortuneight, more a general observation.
I am not as enthusiastic about Marina Hyde as others are, though she can say clever things, or phrase observations others have also made in a witty way,
However, not to be alarmist about it, I am reminded of quotes about how powerless the Weimar cabaret scene was in confronting the Nazi regime.
i don’t think Trump, MAGA or the alt right in general care about how they are seen – they seem impervious to satire. A different approach is needed.
What’s to stop Trump using an executive order to overturn any pardon from Biden? He appears to be able to overturn everything else.
On a separate matter, did anyone else spot the similarity with Melania Trump, in her weird hat, and Lee Van Cleef’s character in The Good, The Bad And The Ugly?
On such a miserable day for the world, it was nice of her to pay homage to a great film. And to the black spy from Spy vs Spy, and Carl McCoy from the Fields of the Nephilim. Who could have guessed that the latest Mrs Trump is a goth?
Wouldn’t it be lovely if the next UK Trump visit takes in Stevenage, as Melania goes on a ‘Neff pilgrimage? I know one of them used to drink in a pub on the Broadwater estate.
I have this slightly fuzzy vision of you in a not-so-rundown shack not far from a tropical beach. You are ever so slightly stoned from that lunchtime spliff your beautiful wife (one day you’ll tell me how you managed to ensnare her) knows nothing about. You think “I’ll just have a chat with my AfterWord chums” and hey, who needs spellcheck?
With the Senate, House and Supreme Court in his pocket, there is not much that Trump cannot do now. Perhaps he will set a precedent (again) by unpardoning those pardoned by Biden. The only restraint that I can see to his unchecked power is public opinion – and that’s where the tech-bros come into play for the Orange One.
Jonathan Pie agrees with this sort of idea in his latest video: left-wingers/Democrats have concentrated on the wrong things and left the door open for Trump and other populists.
Listening to DJT’s speech, I could imagine millions of Americans nodding in agreement with every word. Somehow, unless he does it himself, the Dems have to convince those millions that Trump was a mistake, and that they are the ones focusing on the issues facing ordinary people.
I’m sort of hoping that the wheels fall off Trump’s burning clown car fairly quickly and voters see him and his coterie for what they are. But if that does happen, the Dems have to a worthy alternative. At the moment, they seem to be absent to all intents and purposes.
Let’s talk about Trump, technology , technology tsars and widening wealth disparity.
Marx and Engels, remember them saw technology as pivotal to freeing the working man from the drudgery of labour. The rocketing efficiency would “fund” the socialist paradise. At least that’s my recollection.
But , importantly they saw these stages of economic distribution generationally. Remember Lenin hastily hopping on a train to lead the Russian revolution? It wasn’t supposed to happen then but generations later. As a student of economic history he saw socialism and communism as natural economic evolution.
Which brings me to my main point. Rather than freeing the worker, AI and robots seem likely to further impoverish the working class. And the ruling elites seem hell bent on further impoverishing them by eroding the welfare state – argued by many to have been capitalisms safety valve against working class revolution.
So is Trumpian capitalism closer to the final stage of capitalism that Marx contemplated?
Isn’t the current enormous disparity of wealth just symptomatic of the pioneers of a new technology having monopoly control, similar to the oil barons of the early 20th century? The tech bros aren’t engaged in wealth creation, but in wealth extraction – taking so much wealth from the rest of the population – surely a major contributing factor to unrest, populism, extremism.
Like previous technological breakthroughs, isn’t the answer to break up the monopolies to allow societies to function once again. Last time it took two world wars and the destruction of a lot of the ‘assets’ of the propertied class to knock sense and an Attlee government/Marshall plan into the system.
Could we skip 30 years of global conflict and destruction and get straight on with the rebalancing this time, please?
As long as they can keep working people poorly-educated and fighting among themselves instead of against them, the billionaires are going to be safe enough.
4 billionaires in the USA have more wealth than the bottom 50% of its population – frightening stuff but wasn’t it ever so?
I suspect back in feudal England the disparity between rich and poor was even greater.
But I’ll say it again – all my liberal leftie
days, in general terms life across the globe just kept getting better and even global warming was something that wouldn’t really effect me, the icecaps would melt long after I’m gone.
Now the Right is on the rise everywhere and the climate has gone bonkers.
I’m off to download a nice film starring, preferably, Doris Day and fall asleep content this is all an old man’s dream/nightmare
I have heard it said recently that the post-war 45-73 period was an anomaly from the usual feudal status of nobles and peasants, that there seems to be a rest towards now.
They are ‘pre-emptive’ pardons, to prevent any chance of the vindictive incumbent going after the people concerned. It’s moving into Minority Report territory, but it’s legal in the land of the free, apparently.
Against anything ?
Maybe. Because, you know, America. Where nothing makes sense any more.
Still trying to get my head around it. A White House statement now has a 404 screen. Trump at work ?
I want to see the wording if someone can help me.
Oh yeah, apparently Joe Biden pardoned Marcus Garvey as well. No joke.
https://verdict.justia.com/2025/01/20/bidens-preemptive-pardons-are-an-unprecedented-vote-of-no-confidence-in-the-new-administration
At least Trump’s first day passed by quietly. Withdrawal from WHO, exit from Paris climate accord, pardons to Jan 6 rioters, border emergency delared, plus a lovely nazi salute from Musk etc etc
All these presidential “executive orders” from either Trump or Biden seem to be fundamentally undemocratic.
Many are or will be subject to legal challenge.
Trump controls the Supreme Court too
As Dame Marina Hyde points out “The day marked a personal tipping point for Trump, who has now pulled out of more international agreements than Playmates.”
Never really understood the love for Marina Hyde. I wish her no ill, but how she’s become the darling of the liberal media is baffling. ‘Dame’ isn’t that far off: she’s the daughter of Sir Alastair Edgcumbe James Dudley-Williams, 2nd Baronet. She’s also ‘good mates’ with Piers Morgan (he left his wife for her) and has never had a real job in her life.
So journalist and/or writer aren’t real jobs now?
Journalist? Yes, of course. Columnist? No. Not in the context of doing 38-40 hours per week in any job, let alone a physically demanding job you hate. We always hear that British productivity is down: if Marina can revive the economy with her 500 words per week, I’ll accept it as a real job – as opposed to the sneering whimsy of Piers Morgan’s one-time bedfellow.
You have a very narrow definition of ‘productivity’ and of work itself.
I work in mental health; I don’t really produce anything of economic value. If I’m lucky, I contribute to the marginal improvement of someone’s well-being. Is that even a real job…probably not, by your definition.
And do you target this ire towards all columnists, or just the ones you don’t like?
Speaking as one who was a 1000 words by lunchtime merchant, albeit in a small way, I’d say don’t diss until you’ve tried it.
@Hamlet
Suggest you give the late Jeffrey Bernard a go.
The hectic schedule of drinking and smoking Immortalised in his legendary Low Life column consumed far more than.a paltry 38 – 40 hours a week
@Jaygee
I saw the Jeffrey Bernard is Unwell play (the Peter O’Toole version was on YouTube). I’ve also had a few drinks in the Coach and Horses – the pickled egg behind the bar was rather inspiring in its menace.
Speaking as one who was a 1000 words by lunchtime merchant, albeit in a small way, I’d say don’t diss until you’ve tried it.
Can’t be that onerous if you’re just going to go full-on Jack Torrance and write the same 30-odd words over and over again
Only the first one was me.
Sorry, missed the “As told to” in my race to the bottom of your post
Well, I don’t really like any of them, so it’s not difficult!
I’d say working in mental health plays an invaluable part in the economy; I’m several thousand miles away from being an expert, but if you’re facilitating the mental health of workers an the wider community, you’re a thoroughly good sort in my eyes.
Don’t understand the beatification of Marina Hyde either.
She’s a classic Guardian toff who writes snidey hit pieces on easy targets, always playing to the gallery. Essentially the Regina George of the chattering classes with a slam book to match (see, this stuff is easy).
Her work these days always feels a waste of time; it scratches a bitchy itch best left ignored, it never tells you anything you don’t already know, and it’s awfully, awfully pleased with itself.
Isn’t “awfully, awfully pleased with itself” the Guardian house style?
She writes well
I find her columns entertaining and often funny. Her parents and her love life don’t interest me.
This.
Agreed.
Also this.
Fifthed.
I’ve grown a little bit weary of her schtick lately, because, recognisably, that’s what it is when you get down to it.
That said, it’s not a bad schtick, as columnist’s schticks go.
Her schtick – see also John Crace in the same paper – reaffirms and comforts her fans’ views week in week out. The comments under each of her columns, span the gamut from sycophantic to the fawning, everyone gets a chance to get really, no, really quite angry indeed! Some will call Tories/men/Trump/Musk “utter cockwombles” again and everyone’s happy.
Still, it’s not a bad schtick as Mike says, and it’s pointless expecting Hyde or any similar columnist to venture out of their cosy comfort zone. I know its not easy knocking out 800-odd words of crowd pleasing prose weekly but post Brexit, post Farage/Reform, post Trump, post-everything, to me it just feels a bit feeble and predictable. She’s as predictable as the likes of Allison Pearson, Rod Liddle or Melanie Phillips are for the other side.
Don’t get me started on that smuglord Osman tho.
Spot on.
Reading Hyde’s column takes you further away from understanding what’s going on, partly because it’s empty calories, but mainly because her gaze will go wherever Trump and co direct it, since she can’t resist a social media friendly zinger. Hyde is part of the circus we all need to learn to look beyond, constantly groping for “engagement”, constantly falling into the same traps as a result.
I took a look at her piece about the inauguration this week and it was exactly as you’d expect. Musk’s odious salute in the opening, plenty of material on Lauren Sanchez’ bra (presumably more than can be said for the bra itself), and a short throwaway para towards the end on the Trump Coin, the development which one suspects all this cabaret is designed to distract us from, and to which Hyde gives little thought. The salute and the bra will be chip wrapping next week, but overseas interests will still have a channel to funnel crypto payments to the President of the United States.
Exactly as you say, it’s lovely to get together with like minded people and chuck creative pejoratives around. It probably has some therapeutic value, and maybe people need that. But it doesn’t help you understand anything – in fact it only takes you further away. What we need to get better at is figuring out how to pick our way through the bullshit, rather than luxuriating in it because it’s great soap opera and grist for the mill.
Seems a bit reductive to me. I’m not relying on Hyde to shape my views of Trump or any other major news issue. Plenty of other trustworthy sources for more serious analysis.
But there’s a role for satire, mockery and general piss taking as well. It’s often quite powerful. I think it’s OK to have both. Maybe some people just rely on the piss taking, but I think that’s on them.
Yeah, that’s true. I don’t find much satirical value in the articles either, but that’s in the eye of the beholder.
That said, I think Hyde perhaps exerts more influence on thinking in certain circles than you’re giving her credit for.
Still, each to their own. All I can explain is why I find her writing so off-putting.
I’m not sure who to reply to with this comment, so much has been said above in a mixture of subthreads – this isn’t really a reply to fortuneight, more a general observation.
I am not as enthusiastic about Marina Hyde as others are, though she can say clever things, or phrase observations others have also made in a witty way,
However, not to be alarmist about it, I am reminded of quotes about how powerless the Weimar cabaret scene was in confronting the Nazi regime.
i don’t think Trump, MAGA or the alt right in general care about how they are seen – they seem impervious to satire. A different approach is needed.
What’s to stop Trump using an executive order to overturn any pardon from Biden? He appears to be able to overturn everything else.
On a separate matter, did anyone else spot the similarity with Melania Trump, in her weird hat, and Lee Van Cleef’s character in The Good, The Bad And The Ugly?
On such a miserable day for the world, it was nice of her to pay homage to a great film. And to the black spy from Spy vs Spy, and Carl McCoy from the Fields of the Nephilim. Who could have guessed that the latest Mrs Trump is a goth?
Wouldn’t it be lovely if the next UK Trump visit takes in Stevenage, as Melania goes on a ‘Neff pilgrimage? I know one of them used to drink in a pub on the Broadwater estate.
Was that Melania or the Nephilim?
Good question. There’s a lot of similarity between Broadwater and her homeland (Soviet-era Yugoslavia), so she’d fit right in.
Yes, but where would she get the white powder to simulate the ‘just stepped out of a bread factory’ look that Carl, Nod and the gang affected?
Believe me, there’s no shortage of white powder available in the estate pubs of ‘Nidge.
In that article they aay no capacity to unpardon.
I have this slightly fuzzy vision of you in a not-so-rundown shack not far from a tropical beach. You are ever so slightly stoned from that lunchtime spliff your beautiful wife (one day you’ll tell me how you managed to ensnare her) knows nothing about. You think “I’ll just have a chat with my AfterWord chums” and hey, who needs spellcheck?
You try typing at 3 am with the phone screen on dim to not disturb one’s betrothed.
Another candidate for the Afterword monthly strapline competition.
With the Senate, House and Supreme Court in his pocket, there is not much that Trump cannot do now. Perhaps he will set a precedent (again) by unpardoning those pardoned by Biden. The only restraint that I can see to his unchecked power is public opinion – and that’s where the tech-bros come into play for the Orange One.
The world will have to just tough it out until the mid-terms in two years time.
Should he lose control of the house and/or senate (hopefully both), he’ll be a lame duck for his last two years in office.
If he keeps control of both, there is no telling what he might do.
The Dems really need to get their house in order and fast.
Jonathan Pie agrees with this sort of idea in his latest video: left-wingers/Democrats have concentrated on the wrong things and left the door open for Trump and other populists.
Listening to DJT’s speech, I could imagine millions of Americans nodding in agreement with every word. Somehow, unless he does it himself, the Dems have to convince those millions that Trump was a mistake, and that they are the ones focusing on the issues facing ordinary people.
I’m sort of hoping that the wheels fall off Trump’s burning clown car fairly quickly and voters see him and his coterie for what they are. But if that does happen, the Dems have to a worthy alternative. At the moment, they seem to be absent to all intents and purposes.
Two things about the Dems: they have become the party of war, and they have abandoned their old working class base as a gift to Trump.
@chinstroker
Given the worrying rise of support for Remain, the second part of your observation contains a warning that FGK et al would do well to heed
Dreading seeing the convoy of exploratory drilling rigs rolling into pristine Alaskan wilderness with “ fuck you greenies” banners.
Given his current stance on Canada, I doubt we would let those rigs drive through
Hmmm maybe. Maybe a contra will be agreed. Or they get shipped in.
Let’s talk about Trump, technology , technology tsars and widening wealth disparity.
Marx and Engels, remember them saw technology as pivotal to freeing the working man from the drudgery of labour. The rocketing efficiency would “fund” the socialist paradise. At least that’s my recollection.
But , importantly they saw these stages of economic distribution generationally. Remember Lenin hastily hopping on a train to lead the Russian revolution? It wasn’t supposed to happen then but generations later. As a student of economic history he saw socialism and communism as natural economic evolution.
Which brings me to my main point. Rather than freeing the worker, AI and robots seem likely to further impoverish the working class. And the ruling elites seem hell bent on further impoverishing them by eroding the welfare state – argued by many to have been capitalisms safety valve against working class revolution.
So is Trumpian capitalism closer to the final stage of capitalism that Marx contemplated?
Isn’t the current enormous disparity of wealth just symptomatic of the pioneers of a new technology having monopoly control, similar to the oil barons of the early 20th century? The tech bros aren’t engaged in wealth creation, but in wealth extraction – taking so much wealth from the rest of the population – surely a major contributing factor to unrest, populism, extremism.
Like previous technological breakthroughs, isn’t the answer to break up the monopolies to allow societies to function once again. Last time it took two world wars and the destruction of a lot of the ‘assets’ of the propertied class to knock sense and an Attlee government/Marshall plan into the system.
Could we skip 30 years of global conflict and destruction and get straight on with the rebalancing this time, please?
As long as they can keep working people poorly-educated and fighting among themselves instead of against them, the billionaires are going to be safe enough.
Scary stuff.
https://www.whitehouse.gov/issues/
4 billionaires in the USA have more wealth than the bottom 50% of its population – frightening stuff but wasn’t it ever so?
I suspect back in feudal England the disparity between rich and poor was even greater.
But I’ll say it again – all my liberal leftie
days, in general terms life across the globe just kept getting better and even global warming was something that wouldn’t really effect me, the icecaps would melt long after I’m gone.
Now the Right is on the rise everywhere and the climate has gone bonkers.
I’m off to download a nice film starring, preferably, Doris Day and fall asleep content this is all an old man’s dream/nightmare
I have heard it said recently that the post-war 45-73 period was an anomaly from the usual feudal status of nobles and peasants, that there seems to be a rest towards now.
In other news, a load of fat men with beards have been released from prison.
So that’s where Moose and Saucecraft have been these last few months
Not for long:
https://www.dailykos.com/stories/2025/1/22/2298501/-Trump-pardoned-Jan-6-rioter-arrested-a-day-later-on-gun-charges-he-s-also-a-convicted-wife-beater?pm_campaign=front_page&pm_source=trending&pm_medium=web