I’m not putting this in the Nights Out section because this show has already appeared in it and this post isn’t really a review, more an appeal to Afterworders to see whether I’m an outlier or whether anyone else has had a similar experience to me and can tell me I’m not crazy.
I went to see ABBA Voyage a few days ago and have been mulling it over since. I went expecting to have a great time but ended up deeply underwhelmed and a more than a bit annoyed.
As a visual spectacle, the Abbatars were quite something. The sections of the show in which the group were presented on stage as if they were really there were pretty convincing although the huge close up shots of the performers that appeared alongside them were not convincing at all – they looked like they were straight out of a video game. But there were several occasions when the Abbatars were not present and we simply listened to songs and stared at low grade animation that looked downright shoddy to me, neither engaging me in whatever odd “story” they were telling nor visually remarkable – you see equally good animation on kids’ tv shows any day of the week in my opinion. So that was a bit disappointing.
But the sound. Oh my goodness, the sound! I thought I had booked perfect seats. We were in the centre block, looking straight down the arena and not very far back, though far enough back from the (unsponsored) moshpit for comfort and a cracking view. If the sound was going to be good anywhere in the arena, I’d have thought it would have been good where we were sitting. But it was atrocious.
Minor complaint first: there was a bit of echo. I’m no sound technician but I guessed that was probably to do with the room rather than the amplification. Apologies to the experts here if that is naive. But if I’m right, it suggests some shoddy design work doesn’t it? You’d have thought that someone building a single-purpose hall for one show perpetually repeating the same music would have been able to make sure it didn’t echo. I bet @fentonsteve would have come up with something much better. Maybe I’m being harsh or unrealistic but no matter because it’s not my main complaint.
The real problem was that the mid-range was largely absent from the amplified sound. As a result, the high-end of the vocals, especially on the songs with more high notes was very prominent and very unnatural. At times, they sounded like The Chipmunks. And on most of the rest of the songs, the voices were not natural at all. I am pretty familiar with ABBA’s hits – I owned pre-recorded ABBA cassettes back in the day and have played the ABBA Gold CD many times – and I’ve listened back to the originals of the songs played in the show as well as listening to a few YouTube clips from ABBA live shows and I’m convinced that what I heard in the ABBA Arena was not a remotely accurate representation of how ABBA’s voices sounded. It’s hard to be certain how the band in the arena were supposed to sound because they were live and I don’t know what they were aiming for but my impression was that the instruments too lacked mid-range amplification. I’ve felt that live shows have lacked mid-range before but never to such disastrous effect.
In short, the bad sound ruined the experience. Talking to one of the friends I went with, he had similar impressions to mine. Even my wife, who is far less likely to notice sound quality than I, thought the voices sound unnatural and unpleasant. So it wasn’t just me.
I’ve looked quickly around the internet and can’t see any significant adverse comments on the sound so I’m feeling baffled. Has anyone else been and heard similar problems? Or did everyone just love it? Is it possible I went when the sound engineer had set things up wrongly? Is there an explanation for this that can stop me thinking the show is a shoddy rip-off?
ABBA Voyage – is it just me?
by 42 Comments
Yes I went about 3 months ago. I had reasonably high expectations as I knew several people who went and thought it was brilliant.
I thought it was at best average. The holograms (sorry refuse to use Abbatars) were only partially convincing and looked as if they could have come from Madame Tussaud’s.
The sound was not as good as listening on a good hifi at home.
Obviously the audience bought into it largely without any critical input. I am not a massive ABBA fan so was not likely to rave about it but my probably lofty expectations based on comments I had heard were missed by some distance.
But they aren’t holograms at all, it’s more animation
There was something in the air that night (inevitably)…boom, tish (perhaps that’s how it sounded?)
Can you hear the drums?
at Nandos
(old joke)
“Very bad when drums stop.”
There is no way you can deny it
I thought it was absolutely wonderful. I was on the “dancefloor” right at the back, but dead centre (we got there late) and the sound was absolutely fine, incredible in fact.
Oh and they didn’t necessarily use the studio released vocals. Some were from live performances and some from alternate unreleased takes I believe.
That was why I listened to a load of live performances on YouTube. They sounded entirely unlike what I heard in the ABBA Arena. On t’internet through fairly good desktop speakers, they sounded natural and tuneful and I could tell what they were singing. Not so in the “concert” through what I would assume was expensive amplification and speakers.
I haven’t been because, quite honestly, I’d rather go and see Bjorn Again again.
I have noticed a fashion in live sound over recent years for earth-pummeling sub-bass. It has little to do with musical content (lowest note is 41Hz on a 4-string bass guitar, 30Hz on a 5-string bass, 27Hz on an 88-key keyboard) and just makes the ground shake in a rhythmic doof-doof. Vibrating your whole body makes it feel louder than it actually is (better Value For Money)?
I’ve also noticed that you can’t hear the words, and is that a boy or a girl?
I’ve noticed the same thing about too much bass in the past but in this case the bottom end sounded ok to me. It was the lack of the middle and the possible over-emphasis of the top that drove me mad. And now you mention it, it also made the words harder to hear because part of the sound was “missing”.
The experience is engineered for an uncritical audience who like modern beats and amplification, and don’t care about authentic (not that this can be, given it’s an expensive episode of “Josie and the pussycats”). You wait until they do this to David Bowie or Prince, maybe the Jimi Hendrix Experience (which you could call the “Jimi Hendrix Experience experience”). Then we’ll really have something to complain about. Kiss’s version will be flash but trash (and not good trash), a bit like them. All part of turning what’s left of pop music into light entertainment.
There is a live band playing at the Abba show presumably trained by Bjorn and Benny
The live band includes Victoria “Little Boots” Hesketh!
Aren’t holograms by definition “light” entertainment (“They’re not holograms!” cries Dai)
When that bizarre Time musical (?1984?) featured a huge hologram of Lawrence Olivier’s head, Spitting Image did a sketch about it going haywire and spouting speeches from Henry V and Richard III.
The same could happen with Abba Voyage – “Benny” starts plunking the keys and grunting and shuffling in the manner of Thelonious Monk; “Agnetha” lets forth piercing Yoko wails during Our Last Summer; “Bjorn” adorns I Have A Dream with some inappropriate Johnny Mac-style fusion runs; “Anna-Frid” beatboxes throughout The Day Before You Came.
IT COULD HAPPEN
No it couldn’t. The programming was contracted out to Fujitsu.
Oh…
Two mates went, both opera fanatics but one of them a true Abba fan. The Believer thought it was strictly average, sound distinctly unimpressive, holograms unconvincing. The non-fan thought it was “fantastic, best thing, apart from Julius Caesar in Verona, I’ve ever seen!”
Mind you, the non-believer was amazed to see the Real Abba appear on stage for an encore. He was very, very disappointed to be told “It’s not them, you fool!!!”
It’s unclear whether your two “mates” went separately or together. Please clarify.
Them is husband & husband so, yes, together
Thank you. I almost feel like I know them already, such is your ability as a raconteur.
Well… I loved it. It looked great and although like everyone else in the place I was bellowing along to every song, the bits in between the vocals sounded pretty damn great too.
Well, I loved it. We were on the dancefloor in a fairly middling position, and the sound to my uncritical ears was…fine, really. I’ve heard better, but also much worse. Certainly no echo as reported by Steve, so maybe the sound guy was having an off day (though since every show must be pretty full, it surely wouldn’t change the acoustics much). Would I have gone to see them in their pomp? Probably not, I wouldn’t have thought of it as their forte. Would I see this show again? I think I would. I’d also happily see Bjorn Again.
(Agree with fentonsteve on the general trend for daft levels of sub-bass, BTW.)
There shouldn’t be any variation in sound quality from night to night, given that the same show is being performed to full houses in the same temperature-controlled space and using the same equipment. Unless there is an equipment failure that they deem too unimportant to cancel for.
As I said above there is a live band playing on stage plus temperature/humidity changes so there will be some variation from night to night.
A quick google search indicates most think the sound is excellent so maybe it was a one off.
I think it says something that if you were on the dancefloor getting down and singing along you had a better time than those seated. While I don’t doubt that for some the sound was lacking, people do underestimate the extent to which a sceptical, wary outlook leads to a more disappointing outcome.
I don’t think I went with a sceptical or wary outlook. I bought seats primarily because my wife is not very tall which means she hates standing at concerts because she can’t see a thing. I did go expecting to enjoy myself. I was surprised when I didn’t. I don’t think it’s asking a lot to expect that the sound at a highly-publicised and very expensive show in a purpose-built arena should be at least quite good. It wasn’t anywhere near quite good.
I don’t disagree with you, Diddley.
And I’d add that over-high expectations of a gig, book, film or even one’s own sexual experiences can lead to a limp, floppy disappointment.
But sometimes an initial ” sceptical, wary outlook” can suddenly be transformed into joyous, sweaty excitement. Be it a concert, a novel, a movie, an orgasm….
“Well, that was not what I was expecting.”
The day before you came? OK that is rather long to wait.
It is possibly the reason my enjoyment levels were less than expected. I would have preferred to be on the dancefloor where the atmosphere would have been better. Where I sat it was a bit tepid.
I’ve just recently been to see it for the third time, and enjoyed it as much as on the first and second visits. There seem to be some pretty lofty and frankly ill-informed criticisms of both the conception and creation of the show. Yes, I must insist that they are *not* holograms, whether people have difficulty with that notion or not. The detailed accounts of how they were created are out there for those who care to investigate, but suffice to say that the members of ABBA were integral to the process and ensure that the projections are as spiritually and emotionally ‘authentic’ as such creations can possibly be. The notion that the same can be done for Bowie, Prince or Hendrix just shows that people *still* have misconceptions or misunderstandings about the show.
The animated sections may not be to everyone’s tastes, but to call them ‘low-grade’ is an insult to the Emmy-nominated animators Shynola who have worked extensively in music videos ( eg Gorillaz, Radiohead) and in major Hollywood features.
The band is comprised of top-notch musicians, some having recognition and credibility as artists in their own right (eg The Klaxons, Little Boots).
The combined voices of Agnetha and Anni-frid going at full-pelt have always had that quality of being on the cusp of shrillness. Listen to I Am The Tiger on record as a prime example; it should be no surprise that an amplified ‘live’ equivalent would be so noticeable.
Everything about this show has been meticulously conceived, planned and executed by creatives all at the absolute cutting edge of their respective professions. I think it’s phenomenal, but don’t just take my word for it; a friend who manages some of London’s most prominent music venues and literally goes to concerts as part of his job description rated Voyage as ‘possibly the best thing I’ve ever seen’.
I don’t know what you mean by “lofty”, Black Type. As for “ill-informed”, if you read the OP again, my criticism is just based on my experience of the show I happened to see. You might disagree with my opinions but they aren’t objectively wrong, they’re just my opinions.
I agree that calling the animations “low grade” is an insult to the people who created them. I don’t know their pedigree but I thought that what I saw in the arena was very low quality. That’s just my opinion but I stand by it.
I didn’t criticise the band. I just said the sound was lousy.
And I was at pains to say that I have gone back and listened to Abba, both their studio and live work, and heard nothing remotely as shrill and unpleasant as I heard in the arena. It may be that I was unlucky and that I got the show on a bad sound day (though I might argue that it’s not entitled to a bad sound day – especially if it has been “meticulously conceived, planned and executed by creatives all at the absolute cutting edge of their respective professions”). You think it’s phenomenal and so does your friend whom you regard as an expert. I’ve seen and heard a lot of music in all kinds of situations. I thought that what I heard in the ABBA Arena was shoddy. I am not saying you are wrong in your perception of the shows you have seen but reporting my own perceptions of the one I saw. I was interested to know whether anyone else had had a similar experience to mine, hence my post.
Thanks for your considered reply, Steve. For clarification, I wasn’t directing my comments just at your OP; perhaps I should have made
this clearer. Regarding the sound, I’ve had seats in three different areas of the Arena, and have always found it to be pretty decent in the context of this kind of environment. Perhaps I’m being the ‘uncritical audience’ of legend, but frankly I don’t really choose to go to concerts with the expectation of finding fault. I’m aware that there’s a general distaste amongst Afterworders for arena shows, but they tend to be the type I attend due to seating and artist considerations, and I’ve experienced much worse examples of the type than this one.
Also, I wouldn’t suggest my friend is an ‘expert’ – is there such a thing? – I was just citing the genuine reaction of someone who has extensive and wide-ranging experience of this milieu, who is not an uncritical viewer and certainly not a great fan of ABBA, but who was blown away by Voyage.
The Cusp of Shrillness.
I’m only here for the prose poetry.
That was Rutger Hauer’s abortive first attempt at the “…Shoulder of Orion” line.
I thought it was an out-take from Relayer
I thought it was just me and so gave fairly non-specific reports when asked what it was like, I didn’t want to go against the flow as I’d not read any negative reviews. Therefore, I’m pleased to hear that it might not be just me.
For context, I’m an ABBA fan, posters on the wall growing up, my first LP was Super Trouper. I’ve also seen many ABBA tributes both high and low end. However, my first instincts about both the new album and Voyage were that they wouldn’t be for me, how could they be anything but slightly disappointing. But I was won over by the lead single and accompanying video. After seeing the hype and reviews about the show and being curious from a tech point of view I thought I should go, maybe this sort of thing would be the “live” experience of the future. So I booked what sounds like similar seats, centre block just behind the dance floor.
I was still a bit sceptical in advance, which is par for the course for me, so I wasn’t particularly underwhelmed, just a bit disappointed not to be proved wrong. Seeing “them” on the stage was quite impressive, but the images on the big screens were just a bit wrong and the animated sections did feel like a bit of a swizz. I can’t go into any technicalities with the sound, but for me it was just a bit too loud which did detract slightly from the listening experience. I’m glad I went, but I think my first instincts were right.
I did find the animated sections less than completely successful. Somebody made the point that it is a break in the show so they can do a costume change which is kind of funny. The other thing was when the Abbatars individually talked to the audience and whoops, laughs and applause made it difficult to hear it all as they didn’t pause and just carried on talking. But I also found that nice in a quaint sort of way.
I never thought I was actually seeing the band on stage and with the current technology I didn’t expect it to be 100% realistic throughout, it was about what I thought I would see, but still very impressive
But the whole thing just hit me on an emotional level, I could probably pick apart other aspects, but it just blew me away and to me it seemed that virtually everybody in the arena felt the same way
Of course it helps if you absolutely love Abba
I found it enjoyable and would definitely recommend going if you can stomach the massive ticket price
But I was also underwhelmed. Without the real ABBA on stage there’s a lack of emotional connection, you may as well just watch a DVD at home
The sound quality I thought was allright but I’m no expert on these matters..
I think the communal effect does make it a more emotional experience, at least in my case. Are ticket prices so high? Think I paid about 60 quid which for a night out in London is pretty reasonable I thought
In a Black Mirror-type future scenario – and as the tech gets better and cheaper – we might see lots of purpose-built venues pop up in the future along the same lines. A Beatles one in Liverpool could have Hamburg, The Cavern, Shea Stadium, All You Need is Love performance, rooftop.
Whatever the Hammersmith Odeon is called now could host classic shows from the past featuring various bands in their yoof.
I guess the issue with bands is the instruments. ABBA can get away with a simple piano and a guitar for the lads but I’m not sure how convincing a drum kit would be, for example.