Apologies for a Twitter post but I thought some here might find this as fascinating as I did.
"I warn you not to be young."
"I warn you not to fall ill."
"I warn you not to grow old."
In 1983 Neil Kinnock warned Britain of the dangers of Tory government.
40 years later, every single thing he warned of has come true. pic.twitter.com/F5TVHyPWEP
— The Mirror (@DailyMirror) January 30, 2023
https://twitter.com/DailyMirror/status/1620161951933374477?t=q0Hnk37RGl0d4fDPkwrEow&s=19
deramdaze says
I remember that.
I also remember Tony Benn being virtually laughed out of one TV studio debate (with complete and utter contempt directed towards him) when he suggested that if you sell off Council Housing there will be no Council Housing for people 20/30/40/50 years down the line.
Baron Harkonnen says
and so it goes Neil and that bastards laugh while they feed at the trough of greed.
Black Celebration says
Probably his best speech.
Although in terms of impact, the speech to the Labour Party Conference in 1985 was a real turning point. For years, the Labour Party pretended that it wasn’t divided at all and played down Militant and other factions in the party. This part was directed at Liverpool’s city council. It was time to lay this bare and let the devil take the hindmost:
“..I’ll tell you what happens with impossible promises. You start with far-fetched resolutions. They are then pickled into a rigid dogma, a code, and you go through the years sticking to that, out-dated, mis-placed, irrelevant to the real needs, and you end up in the grotesque chaos of a Labour council – a *Labour* council – hiring taxis to scuttle round a city handing out redundancy notices to its own workers. I am telling you, no matter how entertaining, how fulfilling to short-term egos …you can’t play politics with people’s jobs and with people’s services or with their homes.
Comrades, the voice of the people – not the people here; the voice of the real people with real needs – is louder than all the boos that can be assembled. Understand that, please, comrades. In your socialism, in your commitment to those people, understand it. The people will not, cannot, abide posturing. They cannot respect the gesture-generals or the tendency-tacticians. ”
They still took another 12 years to get back into power – but this needed to happen.
Baron Harkonnen says
True
Moose the Mooche says
People cannot abide posturing? Dude hasn’t watched the MTV Awards
retropath2 says
I routinely recommend getting neither old nor ill to my patients, as we discuss the likely next steps of referral and/management.
“Management” in health is newspeak for care, in the way deprivation became differences (under Mrs T command to the civil service)
Disease management versus patient care just about says it all to me. Both important but not necessarily overlapping Venn diagrams, with significant loss for those where the care aspect has been forgotten.
Yes, that is a bright and optimistic start to the morning, Retro!
fentonsteve says
Talking of non-overlapping Venn diagrams, I had an interesting telephone chat with a GP recently as my routine bloods flagged up borderline anemia.
“So, can I have this iron infusion thing on the NHS?”
“Yes.”
“How long do I have to wait?”
“Currently: forever.”
Ring up Bupa (Mrs F has family cover through work).
“What are your iron levels?”
*Reads out list of numbers from bloods results*
“Yes, you are anemic, but not anemic enough for us to fund an infusion. Call back when you’re too ill to work.”
I’ve cancelled all my box set pre-orders.
Moose the Mooche says
Blimey, that really is the Afterword equivalent of turning your face to the wall.
Good luck Fents…
fentonsteve says
Bupa also told me they are no longer going to cover “the ongoing costs of chronic illnesses”. So I have 90 days to cure myself of a lifelong condition, before the cover runs out.
They will pay for “one-off corrective surgery” i.e. have my intestines removed and a bag fitted. So that’s nice.
I didn’t want to buy any new records, anyway…
Moose the Mooche says
My Dad was briefly in Bupa through work. Long story short, he discovered that if you don’t buy everything you get nothing. No equivalent of the 2CD set in Asda for them.
fentonsteve says
Was that Bupa or the Wilson Stereo Library?
Moose the Mooche says
As you can see, the WSL was a helluva way to get chicks.
chiz says
Punching well above your weight there, Nigel
Moose the Mooche says
But he has loads of CDs, which as we all know makes a man pretty much irresistible.
salwarpe says
I think you might be confusing irresistible with irredeemable. Or possibly irritable.
Jaygee says
@salwarpe
He said incorrigibly
Moose the Mooche says
Or possibly…. irrelevant
fentonsteve says
“I warn you not to fall over on Brighton beach”
Spoiler alert: he lost the election.
Gary says
Much to everyone’s surprise in ’92. I remember he blamed the press (and the press took the credit). Huh. As if the press have any influence on politics.
Jaygee says
@Gary
On the upside, the emotive speech NK gave about growing up that Joe Biden later passed off as his own undoubtedly helped propel the bubonic plagiarist up the greasy pole on his way to unseating Trump
Black Celebration says
Bubonic plagiarist ! I’m going to nick that and pass it off as my own.
Jaygee says
Sadly, can’t claim as my own – originally said of David Frost by Peter Cook (if you’re going to pinch lines, only ever do so from the very, very best!)
Black Celebration says
Indeed!
Native says
Was that the famous Sun front page of the lightbulb, will the last person to leave the UK…?
Gary says
I remember this one:
Jaygee says
@Gary
@Native
While the paper is a rag that peddles dodgy “news” and unpalatable views, The Sun’s sub-editors are arguably the best in what used to be Fleet Street.
“David takes Elton up the Aisle” after Elton John’s wedding to David Furnish is right up there with the NY Post’s “Headless Body Found in Topless Bar” and the Scotsman’s (????) “Super Cally Are Fantastic Celtic Are Atrocious” in the pantheon of the greatest HLs of all time
Moose the Mooche says
Wasn’t Paddy Pantsdown of theirs too?
Jaygee says
More than likely. Not sure if “Foot heads arms body” was theirs but it’s another corker
Black Celebration says
I can’t quite make out who the lady celebrating on that cover is. Looks a little like TV”s Pam St Clement (Pat out Eastenders). Hope not.
Moose the Mooche says
Is it a lady or….a “lady”?
Black Celebration says
On further research, it’s a grim answer I’m afraid.
The woman posed provocatively in the previous day’s issue under a headline saying that THIS is what page 3 girls would look like under Kinnock. The article is her saying she was glad to do her bit to help the Tories get in. I thought I couldn’t despise that paper any more than I already do but I was wrong.
Moose the Mooche says
Probably Kelvin McKenzie’s work. Another one of his glorious moments was a big picture of a topless 15 year old girl with her hands over her breasts. The caption? “She’s 16 tomorrow and she’ll take her hands out of the way”
Absolutely certain there were two separate photo sessions of course, oh yes….
Black Celebration says
Bloody paedos.
fentonsteve says
I was at secondary school with a girl who appeared topless on page three on her 16th birthday. School assembly that morning was quite a ‘do’.
davebigpicture says
I knew* a girl who appeared in several top shelf magazines when she was 17 or 18. She was quite matter off fact about it.
*Not like that
Native says
Yeah – remember that one well.
This is the one I was referring to –
https://www.thesun.co.uk/wp-content/uploads/2019/11/tp-graphic-top-10-pages-top.jpg
Jaygee says
@fentonsteve
@Gary
Labour under NK in 1992 did a lot better than people think, effectively only losing the election by just 1,240 votes.
Those 1,240 votes being the Tories’ accumulated winning margin in the bottom 11 constituencies that made up Major’s 21-seat majority
fentonsteve says
I remember it well. I’d only been working for 9 months or so and an extremely smug Tory-voting colleague came to visit my desk. I went for a ‘fag break’ (I don’t smoke) to avoid him.
Black Celebration says
Also, Labour and Lib Dems together attracted 3.5m more votes than the Conservatives. 52% of the popular vote against 42%.
fentonsteve says
Yeah, but when has 52% of the vote ever lead to a disaster, eh?
Black Celebration says
If Brexit was FPP and the 382 voting areas were constituencies – that wafer thin popular vote majority would have delivered a majority of 141 “seats”.
Gatz says
But it’s a curious fact that Major’s Conservatives in 1992 got the highest number of votes ever for a party at a GE. May got the second highest (since overtaken by Johnson) and could even form a majority government. Then of course they were all but wiped out in the next GE in ’97.
duco01 says
I was also interested to find out that, up until 1950, both Oxford University and Cambridge University used to have seats in the House of Commons (2 seats for each university). Each constituency was not a physical area. Its electorate consisted of the graduates of the University concerned. Bizarre.
Jaygee says
One of the biggest reasons underpinning the flaring up of the “Troubles” in Northern Ireland in the late 60s was the fact that wealthy protestants got two votes – one for their homes and one for any business they owned
chiz says
I’ve seen that 1.240 votes thing before and a similar calculation was used to prove Corbyn lost in 2017 by 12,000 votes, or something.
But isn’t it… bollocks? By the same reasoning, the narrowest 11 victory margins for Labour might have gone the other way by a similar number of votes, and it assumes that votes would transfer directly from Conservative to Labour.
Jaygee says
@chiz
There’s always one…
dai says
He was destroyed by the press, named a “Welsh windbag” (born in the same town as me), but a crucial factor in making Labour electable, Blair wouldn’t have happened without him (for better or worse)
duco01 says
Of course, Kinnock’s daughter-in-law ended up as Prime Minister, although not of the UK.
Alias says
Blair wouldn’t have happened if John Smith had lived.
salwarpe says
I think he would have been someone like Bryan Gould – on the right of the Party, ostensibly supporting the leader, but a moderniser, frustrated (in Blair’s case) by the more leftish, strong state vision that Smith, with Brown as a chief lieutenant would have propelled through parliament. Probably would have left Westminster following a similar path to D Miliband in international affairs, as indeed he has tried to do, post PM.
Jaygee says
If he’d been around today, he’d probably have ended up on Strictly
dai says
I have considered that too, but not totally sure. I remember watching TV night of Election 1992 and Blair was interviewed. I was very impressed, can’t stand him now of course. Some thought Smith was a little passive in the role, an election defeat in 97 and he would have probably been replaced by Blair (or Brown)
Mike_H says
I seem to recall John Smith always having a good answer to any press interrogation. Always calm, collected and good-humoured without any flash. Mick Lynch reminds me of him, somewhat.
fitterstoke says
Has Iain Dale ever interviewed Mick Lynch? Maybe okay on radio, but too weird for telly…
Moose the Mooche says
To be fair, most of us have heeded his warning not be be young
Vulpes Vulpes says
Jezza on Politics Live today, chilled and smiling. Talking sense again. Will he never learn? TBF he did get a good hearing.
dai says
Clarkson?
Vulpes Vulpes says
I said ‘Talking sense’. Pay attention.
Black Celebration says
Today’s rousing speech by Mick Lynch was very well delivered and inspiring and I support the cause 100%.
However, it does strike me that using words like “workers”, “ordinary people”, “working class” and “solidarity ” are terms from 40 years ago and will definitely turn off a lot of people. I know it shouldn’t do…but it does.
The working population of the UK is not an LS Lowry painting. Most don’t work in factories, clocking on and off at the same time and going to the match on Saturday at 3pm. Most don’t identify with organised socialism or class struggle – actually, they run a mile from it because they fear the far-left running things far more than the incumbent Tories.
Jaygee says
“Ordinary people” is probably the most patronising term ever
Moose the Mooche says
The man on the Clapham omnibus be like “Don’t fuckin’ look at me”
Vulpes Vulpes says
Innit.
Mike_H says
Only patronising if used by people who think they are extraordinary.
fentonsteve says
Having been raised in a house with a NUR local rep, the trigger word for me is “Comrades”. I’ve heard a lot of language on the wireless recently that I’ve not had to endure since the late 1970s. Listen – I’m not even your mate, pal.
Ditto “Brothers and Sisters” which, as far as I am concerned, should only ever be followed by “hear the drummer get wicked!”
Gary says
Roger Waters often refers to people as “brothers” or “sisters”. Not when speaking about David Gilmour though, I’ve noticed.
Moose the Mooche says
Tends to assume that everyone comes from a happy family.
Mistress Ploppy: It would be more fun, sir, if he were to change his name. Give the place a more family atmosphere.
Blackadder: A “family atmosphere”?! This is meant to be a place of pain and misery and sorrow!
Mistress Ploppy: That’s what I mean, sir.
Ploppy: Ah, Mistress Ploppy is a bit of a social realist, sir.
Bingo Little says
“Comrades” and “solidarity” are enormously off-putting.
The former, in particular, has been used at certain places and times to inculcate a cumulative suspension of all personal morality in lieu of a grim hivemind. Human beings become truly horrible in packs, and particularly packs where they’ve allowed their individual reasoning to be subsumed. I’m deeply suspicious of anyone who attempts to co-opt me/invite me to suspend critical thought in this fashion. Keep your dogma in its own kennel, thank you very much.
Most of the people who use these terms know they do more harm than good, but ultimately cosplaying as Che Guevara is more important.
In a similar vein, but from a slightly different place on the political spectrum, I’d also file the word “ally”. Sorry, but no allies – just me, my reasoning and my conscience. I might agree with you today and disagree with you tomorrow; all I owe you is to be honest in both situations.
Gary says
“to inculcate a cumulative suspension of all personal morality in lieu of a grim hivemind”
I think that might be the greatest phrase ever written.
Jaygee says
@fentonsteve
Surely “brothers and sisters” should only be followed by the words
“we don’t need this fascist groove thang!”
Moose the Mooche says
I don’t know what this world is coming to when you don’t know that it can only be followed by “I don’t know what this world is coming to!”
BLAP BLAP duggaduggaduggadugga
Yes…..
fentonsteve says
Both good answers there.
I’d like to see Mick Lynch start shouting into a mic “I’m gonna show you what time it is, Boyz!” flanked by some chaps in camo.
fitterstoke says
Hard Left, standing on the right…
Freddy Steady says
I didn’t get where I am today by not knowing what the world is coming to.
Gatz says
Politicians seem a lot less eagre to bleat on about ‘hard working families’ since the hard working families started making their own voices heard.
Moose the Mooche says
Hard working families… all of them? Most of the under 5s I’ve encountered are bloody bone idle.
Alias says
I don’t know why nobody pointed out that the measures that politicians promised to take in order to improve the lives of “hard working people”, equally benefited those in employment who did the absolute minimum that they could get away with.
Moose the Mooche says
I hate those people.
*Looks in mirror*
Hear that, shithead??
Alias says
Reminds me of the time when I worked in an office on the 9th floor of a block and we looked down on neighbouring office blocks. One of my colleagues would look out the window at construction workers on those blocks and say unironically “he’s not working”.
Mike_H says
The problem is, if you want to avoid using those terms, what do you replace them with?
“Solidarity” and “Working Class” are the only ones of the four that I might not want to use in his position. “Workers” and “Ordinary People” are acceptable terms that I think people can relate to.
Black Celebration says
I suppose he could just say “people” – but he seems to be doing OK so maybe I’m being too picky.
fentonsteve says
Members?
It’s the sound of the suburbs, after all.
Freddy Steady says
“That’s right.”
Moose the Mooche says
Stewart Lee in today’s Absurder:
The current Conservative cabinet has had more lineup changes than the Fall, but will not leave as significant a cultural legacy, bar a similarly large succession of weighty books trying to make subsequent sense of what happened. If it’s Rishi Sunak and your granny on bongos, then this is the Conservative government.